Silk Road forums

Discussion => Security => Topic started by: semolinaz on August 06, 2013, 11:24 pm

Title: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: semolinaz on August 06, 2013, 11:24 pm
Looking to make cash deposit's through localbitcoins & then to SR, what should i use in between? Bitcoinfog looks good but looks as though it takes a long time for things to process properly, how long i dont know for sure though as ive never done it? It also confuses me a bit with all the options when withdrawing & just throws up more questions as to whether i am doing things right or not!

&...

Blockchain requires java - not good, right?

thanks
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: personaluse on August 07, 2013, 05:19 am
I have personally used bitcoinfog before - they do take a while to come through, but always have.

I -believe- SR actually has tumbling running behind the scenes (can anyone confirm this?) to obsfucate transactions. The only catch with all these things is that they take time. Unless you explicitly specify, as the network confirms transactions, people running rigs will normally take a small fee off the top (it's in there as an incentive for people to allocate processing power to doing this).

Without people putting processing power towards it, you'd never get those coins turning up post payment! (or it would take a -very- long time)
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: Jack N Hoff on August 07, 2013, 05:20 am
The Blockchain.info mixing service is a joke.  A blind monkey could follow those coins.
The SR mixing service is not very good either.
BitcoinFog is excellent!
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: personaluse on August 07, 2013, 05:28 am
The Blockchain.info mixing service is a joke.  A blind monkey could follow those coins.
The SR mixing service is not very good either.
BitcoinFog is excellent!

Hi - not trying to be silly, but I'm honestly curious how to evaluate if s mixing service is 'good' (or not). I've wondered about the SR system - what are your gripes with it?
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: Jack N Hoff on August 07, 2013, 06:02 am
The Blockchain.info mixing service is a joke.  A blind monkey could follow those coins.
The SR mixing service is not very good either.
BitcoinFog is excellent!

Hi - not trying to be silly, but I'm honestly curious how to evaluate if s mixing service is 'good' (or not). I've wondered about the SR system - what are your gripes with it?

Run a taint analysis on a wallet address after mixing with BitcoinFog to see how good good it is.

Well, it sent a vendor's coins through a wallet address that had seen more than a half a million bitcoins.  That isn't very good mixing if you ask me...

The SR tumbler is pretty shitty.  Remember the Casey Jones case?  Over a half a million coins went through one wallet address if I remember correctly.  That isn't very good tumbling in my opinion...  It should be using more new wallet addresses.
I didn't realize the SR Tumbler was shitty. I have noticed it split my coins into many transactions and many addresses. I'm not familiar with the Casey Jones incident.

Quote
There is one other transaction in the referenced account, for 17.24btc which entered 5/22/13 and is transferred out 5/28/13 - It moves through one intermediary account, is then combined into a block of 200btc and moves through an account that transacts only in 100 or 200btc blocks totaling 10,100btc.  Following any one of those 200btc blocks leads you to apparent “mixer” transactions, small amounts of value peeling off of the larger amount at each hop.    Taint analysis reveals that nearly 10% of those bitcoins eventually pass through an address responsible for transacting more than 419,000btc since 2012

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/post/53700133097/users-bitcoins-seized-by-dea

http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20130707/PC16/130709585/1177/digital-currency-seized-in-alleged-drug-law-violation-in-charleston
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: bluedev1 on August 07, 2013, 08:35 am
I just thought of an idea that could skip Bitcoinfog (and thus skip the wait and potential 3% fee).   Create a localbitcoins account, "sell them" to a few fake buyers (you) created from tor (1% fee), move the coins to an anonymous online wallet (again from Tor), then move them to SR?   This would at least give you a story.  I don't know how to explain what happens to my bitcoins when they go to bitcoinfog.  Maybe I don't need to... but I'm not sure?
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: semolinaz on August 07, 2013, 10:25 am
ok then, the fog it is.

Thanks for the replies

oh, also is it really needed to split the withdraw up into lots of different smaller payments? < considering as well that my initial purchase of the coins will be a bank cash deposit? Can i just use the option to send in one go ok?
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: Jack N Hoff on August 07, 2013, 10:56 am
ok then, the fog it is.

Thanks for the replies

oh, also is it really needed to split the withdraw up into lots of different smaller payments? < considering as well that my initial purchase of the coins will be a bank cash deposit? Can i just use the option to send in one go ok?

BitcoinFog allows you to have it sent to multiple addresses.  Use at least two.  You don't want to send 10btc to BitcoinFog and have 9.7btc to 9.9btc sent from BitcoinFog to a single address six hours later.  That isn't hard for an investigator to find in the blockchain.  That is the problem with blockchain.info's mixing service.  BitcoinFog allows you to use up to 20 wallet addresses for the clean coins to be transferred to and to choose hour many hours between payments.
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: semolinaz on August 07, 2013, 03:35 pm
so let me get this right... I send the washed coins to 2 or more different addresses in my SR account < so i assume it's possible to have multiple addresses in my SR account at one time ?

thanks & I appreciate the help.
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: SmokesHisBroccoli on August 07, 2013, 05:16 pm
The Blockchain.info mixing service is a joke.  A blind monkey could follow those coins.
The SR mixing service is not very good either.
BitcoinFog is excellent!

I was doing some reading up on the SR tumbler here on the forums and a lot of people seem to think it's a great tumbler.  Not as good as the fog, but still does a real nice job by creating new bitcoin addresses or something.  I'm not too technical with it so I'm not sure.  But I would be interested to know what people think about the SR tumbler.  Is there a way to trace bitcoins through SR once you've made your deposit? 
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: Railgun on August 07, 2013, 06:38 pm
ok then, the fog it is.

Thanks for the replies

oh, also is it really needed to split the withdraw up into lots of different smaller payments? < considering as well that my initial purchase of the coins will be a bank cash deposit? Can i just use the option to send in one go ok?

BitcoinFog allows you to have it sent to multiple addresses.  Use at least two.  You don't want to send 10btc to BitcoinFog and have 9.7btc to 9.9btc sent from BitcoinFog to a single address six hours later.  That isn't hard for an investigator to find in the blockchain.  That is the problem with blockchain.info's mixing service.  BitcoinFog allows you to use up to 20 wallet addresses for the clean coins to be transferred to and to choose hour many hours between payments.

I really like the fog. I think it should be a must when dealing with SR.

I have a question:

I want to withdraw to multiple addresses to make the dispersion greater. Once I click 'get new address' in SR, can I still use the previous address to get my coins? This would allow up to 10 or so deposit addresses in a single SR deposit, but I don't want to lose BTC in finding out.
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: semolinaz on August 08, 2013, 08:54 pm
Im still none the wiser with regard to how multiple deposits work with bitcoinfog>>SR?

Do you have multiple addresses on SR at the same time in order for this to work, im not quite understanding it?
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: NickNack on August 09, 2013, 01:31 am
Im still none the wiser with regard to how multiple deposits work with bitcoinfog>>SR?

Do you have multiple addresses on SR at the same time in order for this to work, im not quite understanding it?

Open an account with BitcoinFog... go to the "Deposit" tab... scroll down and hit the button "Create New Address"

Now you have 2 wallets to initially send your coin to.                      Localbitcoins
                                                                                                                  Λ   
                                                                                    Fog:         Wallet 1     Wallet 2
                                                                                                                  V
                                                                                                                 SR

But if you're just making a cash deposit someplace... you're not giving any personal info, correct?  Like you're making an out of state deposit into someone's bank account?  If so, why tumble?   Just make sure your localbitcoins account is used only for your SR stuff, and over tor. 
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: personaluse on August 09, 2013, 10:54 am
The Blockchain.info mixing service is a joke.  A blind monkey could follow those coins.
The SR mixing service is not very good either.
BitcoinFog is excellent!

Hi - not trying to be silly, but I'm honestly curious how to evaluate if s mixing service is 'good' (or not). I've wondered about the SR system - what are your gripes with it?

Run a taint analysis on a wallet address after mixing with BitcoinFog to see how good good it is.

Well, it sent a vendor's coins through a wallet address that had seen more than a half a million bitcoins.  That isn't very good mixing if you ask me...

The SR tumbler is pretty shitty.  Remember the Casey Jones case?  Over a half a million coins went through one wallet address if I remember correctly.  That isn't very good tumbling in my opinion...  It should be using more new wallet addresses.
I didn't realize the SR Tumbler was shitty. I have noticed it split my coins into many transactions and many addresses. I'm not familiar with the Casey Jones incident.

Quote
There is one other transaction in the referenced account, for 17.24btc which entered 5/22/13 and is transferred out 5/28/13 - It moves through one intermediary account, is then combined into a block of 200btc and moves through an account that transacts only in 100 or 200btc blocks totaling 10,100btc.  Following any one of those 200btc blocks leads you to apparent “mixer” transactions, small amounts of value peeling off of the larger amount at each hop.    Taint analysis reveals that nearly 10% of those bitcoins eventually pass through an address responsible for transacting more than 419,000btc since 2012

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/post/53700133097/users-bitcoins-seized-by-dea

http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20130707/PC16/130709585/1177/digital-currency-seized-in-alleged-drug-law-violation-in-charleston

Awesome! Thanks for that :)
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: semolinaz on August 09, 2013, 12:11 pm
Thanks for that NickNack although I worded my question wrong! I meant to ask I didn't understand how the multiple withdrawls work, not deposits.  ie.. sending money from bitcoinfog to SR in multiple smaller amounts. If you can do this, ie split your withdrawl up into smaller multiple amounts over to SR, then you need multple wallet addresses in SR to receive them in SR right ?

Or, is it the case that you send all of the split up withrawls to only one wallet address at SR and wait for the total to tot up once they gradually arrive ?

Also, yeah alot of advice has been that tumbling after making a cash deposit is not needed, but then i read in a few other places that it's still good to tumble even if you've done it like this initially with a cash deposit. So much conflicting info I thought id just take the safest option!

Thanks for all the advice
Title: Re: Bitcoinfog, blockchain etc.. what to use?
Post by: semolinaz on August 09, 2013, 02:21 pm
so yeah, put a bit more clearly:

When making a withdrawal from bitcoinfog to SR the option is to split the withdrawal up into smaller multiple payments, you then have to enter all the addresses that you want these smaller payments to go to. In SR it appears you can only have one address at a time to send bitcoins to. This confuses me. Please help!