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Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: DrugsAreFunAndCrazy on September 20, 2012, 01:25 pm

Title: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: DrugsAreFunAndCrazy on September 20, 2012, 01:25 pm
What is the difference??
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: b0lixtrader on September 20, 2012, 01:57 pm
If the chemical structure stayed the same.  I don't see it being much different.  Probably the same old debate:  which has a cleaner roll?  White or dark.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: inthedaytimewitha on September 20, 2012, 02:13 pm
idk maybe more was made from sassafras back in the day?
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: Walt White on September 20, 2012, 05:45 pm
I dropped for the first time in 2001...only difference was that MDMA was way easier to find and obtain back then so good high dose pills were more common...
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: 810offsuit on September 20, 2012, 06:29 pm
I dropped for the first time in 2001...only difference was that MDMA was way easier to find and obtain back then so good high dose pills were more common...

I didn't know Walter White used mdma  ???
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: catfishinmysocks on September 20, 2012, 10:50 pm
It's the same.

Pills are a different matter because they contain such a variable amount of MDMA and can have so many different additives. But they generally used to be better, usually contained actual MDMA and more of it along with things like MDA. Lots of MDMA and definitely MDA are too expensive now when you can just use some RC and caffeine.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: smokeweed420 on September 20, 2012, 11:14 pm
It's the same.:)

Pills are a different matter because they contain such a variable amount of MDMA and can have so many different additives. But they generally used to be better, usually contained actual MDMA and more of it along with things like MDA. Lots of MDMA and definitely MDA are too expensive now when you can just use some RC and caffeine.

Disagreed, no research chemical comes close to comparing to the pure magic of mdma. and i have rolled for 10 years and let me tell you. no matter who you are, your first 10 experiences with mdxx are without comparison. after that its not the same new exciting thing anymore (but still very enjoyable) so when people say "back in the day mdma was so much better" its because those were their first rolls. people now who try ecstasy for the first times get the same magical experiences that everyone who started rolling back in the day got. hope that makes sense
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: catfishinmysocks on September 20, 2012, 11:37 pm
Disagreed, no research chemical comes close to comparing to the pure magic of mdma. and i have rolled for 10 years and let me tell you. no matter who you are, your first 10 experiences with mdxx are without comparison. after that its not the same new exciting thing anymore (but still very enjoyable) so when people say "back in the day mdma was so much better" its because those were their first rolls. people now who try ecstasy for the first times get the same magical experiences that everyone who started rolling back in the day got. hope that makes sense

I didn't quite mean that as a blanket statement. But if you look at reports and studies most show that pills contain bollocks now which wasn't so much the case in the past, and MDA wasn't uncommon which is why people had 'trippy' or different experiences at times. As well as what you say, people also like to talk up past experiences, and the past in general a lot too.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: Joey Terrifying on September 20, 2012, 11:41 pm
your first 10 experiences with mdxx are without comparison. after that its not the same new exciting thing anymore (but still very enjoyable) so when people say "back in the day mdma was so much better" its because those were their first rolls. people now who try ecstasy for the first times get the same magical experiences that everyone who started rolling back in the day got. hope that makes sense

yup

this is also why people say raves were so much better back in the day
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: Skippy_Jif on September 21, 2012, 12:06 am
^^^^^that and raves back in the day because the music was MUCH better. Also, the kids nowadays are just a tragedy to rave with! I mean, there was drama in the old school raves mid 90's-early 2000, but now is almost a complete FACEPALM! You almost alwways have to be fucked up to enjoy yourself at raves now or to prevent you from killing someone due to the music and people....lol

What is the difference in precursors used in new MDMA?
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: gestaltassault on September 21, 2012, 02:55 am
I dropped for the first time in 2001...only difference was that MDMA was way easier to find and obtain back then so good high dose pills were more common...

It was also more expensive, though. The price has gone down a lot.
are you kidding? back in 2003 i could get pills that were as strong as the white speakers for around $6 - $7 a pop...
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: gestaltassault on September 21, 2012, 02:59 am
^^^^^that and raves back in the day because the music was MUCH better. Also, the kids nowadays are just a tragedy to rave with! I mean, there was drama in the old school raves mid 90's-early 2000, but now is almost a complete FACEPALM! You almost alwways have to be fucked up to enjoy yourself at raves now or to prevent you from killing someone due to the music and people....lol

What is the difference in precursors used in new MDMA?
i also want to add that raves back in the day didn't have the grand budgets they have today...today these kids get marketed an experience that comes in a flashy extravagant package...

back then we created our own experiences...the current generation doesn't know how to create anything....they have this sense of entitlement and expect everything to be served to them on a silver platter....back then all we had was the music and our imaginations...
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: Theaides on September 21, 2012, 03:02 am
Let's see...the chemical hasn't changed its composition.  I would say it's probably the same chemical it was 15 years ago. 
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: paxpax on September 21, 2012, 03:23 am
The precursor is alwas the same, MDP2P. Safrole and piperanol are the only two routes I've ever known to MDP2P.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: TNY on September 21, 2012, 04:36 am
Pills in the 90's were absolutely unreal, you could depend on most pills at the time to be excellent, the whole scene back then was electric i loved it so much! The pill were alot cheaper then too for the same quality you would get nowadays!
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: gaia on September 21, 2012, 11:25 am
The precursor is alwas the same, MDP2P. Safrole and piperanol are the only two routes I've ever known to MDP2P.

I'm no expert, but I do know that safrole is just about impossible to find now. So surely if there is a difference, it's because of the use of  piperanol. It was always the sassafras route back in the day. But that's probably bollocks, the end result of the chemical structure of MDMA is still the same. MDMA is MDMA etc.

Like smokeweed420 said, the reason for this continuously regurgitated question is more to do with simple burnout. Or familiarity. I know that's how it is with me. I still love MDMA (even though I can no longer use it due to SSRI's :( ), but it's just not the same. It is so set and setting dependent, and I can rarely find the right combination. I think that's down to my age. Most of my friends have given up. SO I often find myself doing it alone as they get off on other things. Alcohol/coke mostly. I end up talking to randoms, but they also seem to be on other things, or more probably wonder who the hell this old tosser is talking to them acting all young like. The older ones probably think I'm some dealer moving in on their territory. So Increasingly, I'm the sad old twat on the dancefloor that I always used to laugh at. Shit innit?

You don't need to be a psychologist to see some of the causes of my depression do you? :)
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: GusParker on September 21, 2012, 12:54 pm
What is the difference??

Hate to say it, but part of the difference is YOU!

Having said that, I have the revered White Speakers as offered by various reputable vendors through this site and whilst I can say that they truly put me on my fkn arse, I never got the same euphoric buzz of them as I did of a pill (Smarties) that I simply procured of the streets. These Smarties felt a lot more like old 'old school' pills than did the White Speakers. The smarties made me much more extrovert, energetic etc. whereas the Speakers gave me a kind of a chilled introverted /contentmenteuphoria and they did the same thing to my girlfriend who was rolling for the first time ever in her life.

I think it is likely that the pills are different and perhaps the Holy Grail which the old school crowd seek (and by old school I mean early 90's, not early 2000's), is infact a cocktail of drugs including MDMA. Probably MDA content in the good old fashioned pills is what is missing in the modern day equivalents.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: gaia on September 21, 2012, 06:31 pm
I think it is likely that the pills are different and perhaps the Holy Grail which the old school crowd seek (and by old school I mean early 90's, not early 2000's), is infact a cocktail of drugs including MDMA. Probably MDA content in the good old fashioned pills is what is missing in the modern day equivalents.

Yeah, not to mention speed. Pills and speed went hand in hand back in the 90's. In the UK certainly And we are talking proper speed, not the shit you get now.  Jarvis had it right when he sang he was "sorted out for E's and wizz." It would have been rude to argue.

Have to agree with you about the speakers Gus. I was well twatted. In a nice floppy sort of way as you describe perfectly. I never felt like hugging anything though. But I certainly talked shit. Complete shit. Most of which I instantly forgot about.

And no, I don't want a debate on old school speed vs recent shite. There is no debate. :) I had some really nice phet stashed away from about 14 years ago I had forgotten about, that I was pleased to discover last year. I won't tell you where I hid it though. Not clever. Anyway, one pissed up night with little else to try, we broke into it, just to test it out. Aww man, it all came back. Even though I was so much older as was the speed! It still took me right up there again and we were kings for a night again. Contrast that to most of the times I've tried recent speed, and all I get is an edgy, paranoid, fidgety mix that keeps me awake. Though I did have some nice stuff about 6 years ago, so I'm sure it is out there somewhere. Just not in any abundance.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: k5053 on September 21, 2012, 10:44 pm
how much is it usually for 1 liter of sassafras oil? and for (quite) pure safrol??
i have some.. maybe i could sell... :)

otherwise i'm 100% agree with sentences about mdma and raves....

old school... every generation in every situation (music scene, drug scene... etc) use that word when they start feeling old and nostalgics  ;) :D
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: chrispi on September 21, 2012, 10:48 pm
i first dropped in 1989, and there was stuff we called chocolate chips, that was just badass....it was tan pills with chocolate colored chunks in it, and they slapped everyone down.  since then, its been  milder, but still  ok!  i think the crystal mdma must be the purest way to get hi on it., but some tabs out there are still kickin. and the same with speed..it all turned into ice which wasnt real ice, just what folks had to do with the new ingredients i guess, now speed is painful and super tweaky paranoia...its unpleasant to me, not worth the pain. i wish it was still that ether based that made u cough...and everything spectacular!...and nearly spun the top of yer head off!
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: darthvaderstar on September 22, 2012, 12:20 am
Didn't pills back then have mdma/mda together?
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: Limetless on September 22, 2012, 02:46 am
Threads like this slightly annoy me because it just seems like old bastards trying to say their good times were better than the "Youth of Today's" good times - "Ohhhh well when we took Ecstasy back in the Summer of '89 we really took it".

Makes me immediately think "Yeah alight then old man river, jog the fuck on now because I'm yawning", just a way for people to big themselves up and be nostalgic.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: chrispi on September 22, 2012, 02:09 pm
not better than today, just different, nobodys tryin to be better than anybody else, its not a competition, its just a question.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: chrispi on September 22, 2012, 02:12 pm
Didn't pills back then have mdma/mda together?
/quote]

idk, i never made em nor tested em, just popped em, same today ;D
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA
Post by: müslix on September 22, 2012, 04:20 pm
OP please change that thread title.

The precursor is alwas the same, MDP2P. Safrole and piperanol are the only two routes I've ever known to MDP2P.
c/p from bluelight.

http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/chemistry/mdma.impurity.study.html

Route I: PMK → N-formyl-MDMA → MDMA
Route II: PMK → N-formyl-MDA → MDMA
Route III: safrole → MDPBP → MDMA.

The impurities change and therefore some effects might change. There's also the chance that the stereochemical configuration might have changet, that would alter effects quite a bit.

PMK used to come from China, it was banned 2002 or 2003, resulted in a MDMA drought and the dutch picked up another route.
There's detailed statistics about that time period (well all timeperiods since ca. 1995) that show this. And there is studies of subjective effects on people. Totally awesome, Amphetamine went through something similar, but you won't find shit. There's even a newer study that looked at how the high of pills with different active adulterants changed.

When I started, there were only pills. MDMA was extremely rare. Sometimes when you got very very lucky, you could buy a cap and the crystals always looked like transparent glass. All the brown stuff came later. Chemists to lazy too wash now? :P Don't want to advertise or anything, but OldAmsterdam claims he has MDMA made from China PMK-oil. And there is a picture from a user. That's what all mdma used to look. Now it's green :)

edit: borrowed from 3jane thread: http://xfq5l5p4g3eyrct7.onion/view.php?image=7fc589e7e7c3c253cfe07883f776297e.jpg
This fits even better. I had a big break during that time and when I was back I couldn't believe that mdma crystals can be brown.
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: müslix on September 22, 2012, 04:37 pm
Yeah, not to mention speed. Pills and speed went hand in hand back in the 90's. In the UK certainly And we are talking proper speed, not the shit you get now.  Jarvis had it right when he sang he was "sorted out for E's and wizz." It would have been rude to argue.

Agree for the most part, but
>> And we are talking proper speed, not the shit you get now.
Buy 1g from Boymaster and say that again haha ;D This gear is unreal, just like it used to be. After a long enough break it will hit you like a train. Shouldn't be a problem with SSRIs. Mostly dopaminergic, as it should be. Recommended to everyone who remembers the old shit that could almost replace an E. The other guys can get FireUK speed :P
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA
Post by: müslix on September 22, 2012, 05:30 pm
It is so set and setting dependent, and I can rarely find the right combination. I think that's down to my age. Most of my friends have given up. SO I often find myself doing it alone as they get off on other things. Alcohol/coke mostly. I end up talking to randoms, but they also seem to be on other things, or more probably wonder who the hell this old tosser is talking to them acting all young like. The older ones probably think I'm some dealer moving in on their territory. So Increasingly, I'm the sad old twat on the dancefloor that I always used to laugh at. Shit innit?

Oh boy, did you read my diary? :) During the mdma-boom years, you could go out to any given party and there was half the crowd on mdma. Was more of a cultural thing, everyone wanted to try and you met a diversity of people all having fun together on mdma. Just that vibe alone was priceless. It was everywhere, I could go on Parties/Raves alone and 1h in I had 10 new best friends :) Won't happen again I fear, but I'm glad I was there. If I go out now, half the people are on 20 weird RCs combined with weed, alcohol, real drugs. All the mdma "we are one big family" feeling went away. There's nice and kind people everywhere, but during the mdma boom years, wherever you went you could find a core group of people you could roll with. That core stuck together and took care of each other, people might disconnect for hours, but always came back together, this family thing is gone now.

not better than today, just different, nobodys tryin to be better than anybody else, its not a competition, its just a question.
Agree, it just happened that so many different people came together enjoying parties, a boom like so many others. But if you lived through it, it'll never be the same. Just was the right time, the right place and the right drugs :)
We never had 220mg pills. :o Nothing even close to that. The prices were unbelievably high, compared to what I would pay here. Wasn't the MDA thing an urban legend? Every time one guy/gal was doing pills for week(end)s on end without breaks, there was suddenly an MDA pill and it got all tripy.  Imho there was a lot of too much mdma, without necessary recovery involved. I was guilty of that too.

Ah, good memories, best thread I have read in a while 8)
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: chrispi on September 23, 2012, 12:29 am
oh yeah, back in tha day the prices were ridiculous....$25 -30 per pill, and theres no way it could be as pure as now, there was a lot of dirty cut in every pill i ever chewed..sometimes speedy, sometimes paralyzing....always dysfunctional! ;)  ...but good...good memories and times
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: Limetless on September 23, 2012, 05:36 am
oh yeah, back in tha day the prices were ridiculous....$25 -30 per pill, and theres no way it could be as pure as now, there was a lot of dirty cut in every pill i ever chewed..sometimes speedy, sometimes paralyzing....always dysfunctional! ;)  ...but good...good memories and times

Lol, this basically proves my point on what I posted above. The prices went down for a completely different reason to what you are saying and it doesn't even take a firm grasp of economics to understand. Like I said, just old bastards trying to make out like they are the kings of drugs and the "young'uns just don't know how good it was when we are young". Well yano what I hear instead of that? The following - "Blah, blah, bullshit, bullshit, do I know what I am saying? No do I fuck. Am I trying to sound cool and 'Super-cool-and-old-school'? Yes I am".
Title: Re: OLD SCHOOL MDMA VERSUS TODAYS MDMA ??????????????????????????????h
Post by: gaia on September 23, 2012, 10:40 pm
@musflix...Thanks for the tip about Boymastrer, I'll go check them out :)

Glad you can empathize mate. And like you, I'm happy as fuck that I lived through those times and came out the other side. Quite shocked still to be here actually. I still find the old atmosphere at festivals and psytrance events, even though I think the music is, erm, lacking somewhat, the vibe is still good. But other than that, the atmosphere at so many clubs these days can be a bit unpredictable due to so many drug combinations at play as you highlight. It was a magical period of time. We lived through it. Lucky us eh? Move on and wait for the next time :)


... Like I said, just old bastards trying to make out like they are the kings of drugs and the "young'uns just don't know how good it was when we are young". Well yano what I hear instead of that? The following - "Blah, blah, bullshit, bullshit, do I know what I am saying? No do I fuck. Am I trying to sound cool and 'Super-cool-and-old-school'? Yes I am".

Or perhaps, just perhaps said old bastards are actually right? Unless someone does a side by side full chemical analysis, we will probably never know. Dunno about you but I have an open mind - which is surprising given all the chemicals I've thrown at it. But I do have the benefit of having actually sampled the various era's of MDMA of which we speak. I'm not convinced one way or another to be fair. But I stand by my thought that after the first 10 or so times, the initial wonder is dulled somewhat. Don't get me wrong, I still love MD. It's still my go to drug of choice....when I'm not on fuckin SSRI's that is. Bummer. It's enough to make a fella depressed it really is.

I do know of some folks in California who use MDMA as a form of therapy, and they rarely use any of the new stuff. They have all sorts of shit stashed from back in the day, and I believe they have their own chemist who sources their own precursors anyway. Make of that what you will.

Anyway, real ale. You ever had Watney's Red Barrel from back in the day? Party 4's/7's? That was real ale that was ;)