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Discussion => Security => Topic started by: HeatFireFlame on July 07, 2013, 09:52 pm

Title: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: HeatFireFlame on July 07, 2013, 09:52 pm
So i have an anonymous prepaid credit card. A Paypass Mastercard Debit card to be precise, Now on the back of the paper there is instructions , It says for large purchases and withdrawls you may need a PIN, how do i get/check my PIN?

Cheers all
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: ws on July 08, 2013, 07:53 am
Is this one of the anon prepaid cards on SR? I've been looking at this also. But sorry I haven't bought yet so can't answer your question Im afraid
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: kmfkewm on July 08, 2013, 08:21 am
I am not sure what Paypass is, but anonymous credit cards generally fall into two categories. The first category consists of likely-illegal underground cards that are generally very expensive to obtain  (talking in the area of $500-$1,000 just to get the card) and which are loaded with things like Pecunix or Bitcoin. The second category consists of cards that you can buy at a convenience store without showing ID, and which are funded with cash at a convenience store, or by buying reload packs with cash at convenience stores.

In the case of the underground cards, the policies and procedures will vary and you are best to ask the person who sold you the card, or to look at their website.

In the case of the cards sold at convenience stores, they are actually not nearly as anonymous as they seem to be. These cards fall into two categories, reloadable cards and non-reloadable fixed value cards. For any card that is reloadable, and any card that has more than $500 on it, you need to tie the card to your social security number to actually use it for anything. You can purchase the card and put funds on it without tying it to your identity, but to actually activate the card you need to call a number and give identifying information such as your social security number, as well as undergo a background check. After your identity is confirmed, the card is then activated and the PIN is then mailed to you via snail mail.

The only legal anonymous cards are non-reloadable prepaid cards with under $501 dollars on them, but these cards have many restrictions put on them. If you want to buy something off of the internet you will need to tie a social security number to the card, they can only be used anonymously for in person purchases. Additionally, these cards can never be used for cashing out at an ATM.

It looks like Paypass is an official Mastercard reloadable card, and not something being offered by underground criminal networks in Russia.Therefor, chances are extremely high that you get your PIN by calling them, giving up your social security number, having a background check run on you and then having the PIN mailed to your address. Unfortunately you are likely going to have to do this now if you want to get access to the funds on your card, since at this point they are essentially frozen until you confirm your identity. It is unfortunate that so many people seem to think these cards are actually anonymous, it is definitely the impression somebody new to them would have though, as you can purchase them and load money to them at a store without ever having to show an ID. You need to read the fine print to realize that the card you buy at the store is just a marketing gimmick for the most part, as you need to call a number and have your identity confirmed prior to using the card, and you generally will be sent a new card in the mail with your PIN on it after you actually verify your identity and get your account activated.

There are indeed real anonymous prepaid cards, but as I already said they are very often illegal (possibly not to own but I am not sure on that, almost definitely to sell though, and they are shut down and pop up again on a fairly frequent basis). These services tend to charge a large amount of money to obtain a card which can then be funded directly via Bitcoin or Pecunix (or E-gold or Liberty Reserve in the past). The card issuer acts as an exchanger, charging perhaps a 1% fee to load the card after receiving the Bitcoin or Pecunix to put on it. These cards are very frequently sold from countries such as Russia, and you tend to need to do a lot of digging to find a provider of this sort of card, and you need to do your homework to make sure the provider is legitimate and not a scammer. Also, these providers tend to be identified and have the banks backing them pull out after only a few months to a year or so of operation. They are still useful though, as you can have them shipped to a fake ID private mail box and use them for anonymously cashing out E-currency at ATM's. I know two vendors who have cards like this, one of them has about a dozen different ones and he can cash out something like $12,000 worth of Bitcoin a day at ATM's without ever having had to give the provider of the card any of his real information.
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: Jack N Hoff on July 08, 2013, 08:24 am
You have to call and give your social security number and information. :(
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: HeatFireFlame on July 08, 2013, 12:12 pm
I am not sure what Paypass is, but anonymous credit cards generally fall into two categories. The first category consists of likely-illegal underground cards that are generally very expensive to obtain  (talking in the area of $500-$1,000 just to get the card) and which are loaded with things like Pecunix or Bitcoin. The second category consists of cards that you can buy at a convenience store without showing ID, and which are funded with cash at a convenience store, or by buying reload packs with cash at convenience stores.

In the case of the underground cards, the policies and procedures will vary and you are best to ask the person who sold you the card, or to look at their website.

In the case of the cards sold at convenience stores, they are actually not nearly as anonymous as they seem to be. These cards fall into two categories, reloadable cards and non-reloadable fixed value cards. For any card that is reloadable, and any card that has more than $500 on it, you need to tie the card to your social security number to actually use it for anything. You can purchase the card and put funds on it without tying it to your identity, but to actually activate the card you need to call a number and give identifying information such as your social security number, as well as undergo a background check. After your identity is confirmed, the card is then activated and the PIN is then mailed to you via snail mail.

The only legal anonymous cards are non-reloadable prepaid cards with under $501 dollars on them, but these cards have many restrictions put on them. If you want to buy something off of the internet you will need to tie a social security number to the card, they can only be used anonymously for in person purchases. Additionally, these cards can never be used for cashing out at an ATM.

It looks like Paypass is an official Mastercard reloadable card, and not something being offered by underground criminal networks in Russia.Therefor, chances are extremely high that you get your PIN by calling them, giving up your social security number, having a background check run on you and then having the PIN mailed to your address. Unfortunately you are likely going to have to do this now if you want to get access to the funds on your card, since at this point they are essentially frozen until you confirm your identity. It is unfortunate that so many people seem to think these cards are actually anonymous, it is definitely the impression somebody new to them would have though, as you can purchase them and load money to them at a store without ever having to show an ID. You need to read the fine print to realize that the card you buy at the store is just a marketing gimmick for the most part, as you need to call a number and have your identity confirmed prior to using the card, and you generally will be sent a new card in the mail with your PIN on it after you actually verify your identity and get your account activated.

There are indeed real anonymous prepaid cards, but as I already said they are very often illegal (possibly not to own but I am not sure on that, almost definitely to sell though, and they are shut down and pop up again on a fairly frequent basis). These services tend to charge a large amount of money to obtain a card which can then be funded directly via Bitcoin or Pecunix (or E-gold or Liberty Reserve in the past). The card issuer acts as an exchanger, charging perhaps a 1% fee to load the card after receiving the Bitcoin or Pecunix to put on it. These cards are very frequently sold from countries such as Russia, and you tend to need to do a lot of digging to find a provider of this sort of card, and you need to do your homework to make sure the provider is legitimate and not a scammer. Also, these providers tend to be identified and have the banks backing them pull out after only a few months to a year or so of operation. They are still useful though, as you can have them shipped to a fake ID private mail box and use them for anonymously cashing out E-currency at ATM's. I know two vendors who have cards like this, one of them has about a dozen different ones and he can cash out something like $12,000 worth of Bitcoin a day at ATM's without ever having had to give the provider of the card any of his real information.

Thank you for the very informative response.
The card i have is from the Bank of Pekao SA which i presume is poland. It is a paypass-mastercard.
You have one 12 digit number that allows you to check your balance via sms and login to the website.
You get  a card account number which allows you to top up your card.
and a start password code.
On the back of the paper that comes with the card you get information, the second topic is which transactions can be paid with the card?
under that section it says contactless purchases below 50PLN can be made by tapping the card on the reader for larger purchases you will be asked to approve your pin/start code... Now i notice the /startcode bit. wonder if you really do need both.
it says payments in stores approved by pin.startcode.
Cash withdrawal from ATM machines... however it does not say a wthing about a pin or start code... presumably you still need one though.
and it says online payments.

Section 3 says how do i check my balance and transaction history using the card and tells you about sending SMS or checking via website.

And section 4 says Register the card on the website for more options. however it doe not tell you anything about the functions.

on the front under important info, It says this card can be passed onto anyone- when handing over card hand over document also.
daily transaction limit is 500PLN.
Not 100% sure on the type of card, but is there any way you reckon i could cash out no?
bastard, i bought it around a month ago so it seems i fell for the "anonymous" trick.........

Thank you again for your very detailed and informative response.
it is highly appreciated.
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: kmfkewm on July 08, 2013, 01:25 pm
I really don't know the specific details of that card. Things also are probably different in different countries. As far as I am aware, there are no entirely legitimate reloadable debit cards that can be used anonymously, the best you can hope for is a severely limited $500 or less non-reloadable debit card that cannot be used for cashing out or buying things on the internet. Different countries almost certainly have different limits and rules, but all countries that I know about seem to have similar guidelines. Don't feel bad that you fell for the anonymous trick if it turns out to be the case (my guess is that it is the case, but I don't know the laws of your country or the way Mastercard regulates itself there). Lots and lots of people fall for the anonymous trick. You can go to the store and buy these cards and load up to $1,000 on them at the store without ever showing ID, and the only way to learn that you need to tie the card to your identity and get a new one shipped to you in the mail that actually has a PIN and is activated, is if you read the fine print. It really seems to me like they are trying to trick people into thinking they can obtain and USE the cards anonymously, and by the time people figure out they cannot they already have hundreds of dollars frozen waiting for identity verification etc.

As I already mentioned, there are underground companies that do provide real anonymous debit cards, but they are generally either operating illegally or at least covertly. They get a bank to back their cards and then they issue them without obtaining identification from customers, without telling the bank what they are doing, and then operating as E-currency exchangers as well to let people load the cards. When the bank finds out what is going on they revoke the cards issued and stop doing business with the people (who are generally Russians or Eastern Europeans it seems), and then they need to find a new bank and start up again. Generally there is a several month to a year or so time frame in which the anonymous cards work though, which is plenty of time to use them for cashing out illegal money anonymously at ATM's, but these cards are not really good for long term storage of value and general use as debit cards. They are effectively cash out cards for vendors. 
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: HeatFireFlame on July 08, 2013, 05:06 pm
I really don't know the specific details of that card. Things also are probably different in different countries. As far as I am aware, there are no entirely legitimate reloadable debit cards that can be used anonymously, the best you can hope for is a severely limited $500 or less non-reloadable debit card that cannot be used for cashing out or buying things on the internet. Different countries almost certainly have different limits and rules, but all countries that I know about seem to have similar guidelines. Don't feel bad that you fell for the anonymous trick if it turns out to be the case (my guess is that it is the case, but I don't know the laws of your country or the way Mastercard regulates itself there). Lots and lots of people fall for the anonymous trick. You can go to the store and buy these cards and load up to $1,000 on them at the store without ever showing ID, and the only way to learn that you need to tie the card to your identity and get a new one shipped to you in the mail that actually has a PIN and is activated, is if you read the fine print. It really seems to me like they are trying to trick people into thinking they can obtain and USE the cards anonymously, and by the time people figure out they cannot they already have hundreds of dollars frozen waiting for identity verification etc.

As I already mentioned, there are underground companies that do provide real anonymous debit cards, but they are generally either operating illegally or at least covertly. They get a bank to back their cards and then they issue them without obtaining identification from customers, without telling the bank what they are doing, and then operating as E-currency exchangers as well to let people load the cards. When the bank finds out what is going on they revoke the cards issued and stop doing business with the people (who are generally Russians or Eastern Europeans it seems), and then they need to find a new bank and start up again. Generally there is a several month to a year or so time frame in which the anonymous cards work though, which is plenty of time to use them for cashing out illegal money anonymously at ATM's, but these cards are not really good for long term storage of value and general use as debit cards. They are effectively cash out cards for vendors.
This is a bank one, i reckon the vendor has ordered it from a bank and forwarded it.
Im looking for a cash out card, Thats exactly why i bought it.  So any idea how i could get an anonymous cash out method? Apart from selling on localBTC or buy something and then selling the item ... Any ideas?
 I do have a good way reccommended to my by stexo but thats for when i have a little bt of cash stacked up.
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: kmfkewm on July 08, 2013, 05:16 pm
I have no idea maybe the vendor has set something up allowing you to use it anonymously, up until this point I was under the impression that you obtained the card through a legitimate channel, as it is a legitimate card. Lots of vendors get reloadable debit cards activated with stolen identities and shipped to boxes registered with forged identification matching the stolen identity they used to activate the card. Then customers can send them money by buying reload packs for the vendors card with cash, which the vendor then cashes out at an ATM. This isn't an ideal money transfer scheme, but it is actually quite popular. Perhaps the vendor you obtained the card from already committed identity theft and mail fraud in order to get an activated reloadable debit card, and they are in the business of selling these cards to vendors. I highly suggest that you ask whoever you bought the card from, considering they are most likely to know how to help you. As far as the underground card providers that I am aware of, I don't feel comfortable sharing those here as I don't feel like getting them shut down any faster than they are already likely to be.
Title: Re: Getting your pin With an Anony prepaid credit Card
Post by: HeatFireFlame on July 08, 2013, 09:12 pm
I have no idea maybe the vendor has set something up allowing you to use it anonymously, up until this point I was under the impression that you obtained the card through a legitimate channel, as it is a legitimate card. Lots of vendors get reloadable debit cards activated with stolen identities and shipped to boxes registered with forged identification matching the stolen identity they used to activate the card. Then customers can send them money by buying reload packs for the vendors card with cash, which the vendor then cashes out at an ATM. This isn't an ideal money transfer scheme, but it is actually quite popular. Perhaps the vendor you obtained the card from already committed identity theft and mail fraud in order to get an activated reloadable debit card, and they are in the business of selling these cards to vendors. I highly suggest that you ask whoever you bought the card from, considering they are most likely to know how to help you. As far as the underground card providers that I am aware of, I don't feel comfortable sharing those here as I don't feel like getting them shut down any faster than they are already likely to be.

could well be, your right, i have just messaged them now asking.
well if it isnt im going o have to go searching for a vendor somewere of the ccs your talking about...
il see whats happening. thanks for all your advice mate