Silk Road forums

Discussion => Philosophy, Economics and Justice => Topic started by: Master Reaper on December 21, 2012, 12:46 am

Title: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: Master Reaper on December 21, 2012, 12:46 am
The question isn't more than the subject. Let's say I wanted to have a service, you send me cash, I send you BTC at a huge discount. I give my real address to the buyer of said service to send cash to me. Can I expect LE banging down my door. I am not doing anything illegal, I am just using the Silk road to sell legal items. Any input on this would be of great help
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: CrazyBart on December 21, 2012, 12:51 am
I don't see what they could charge you with. Just don't ask the buyer what they plan to spend the btc on.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: gharaniq on December 21, 2012, 01:11 am
I think it would be illegal because of tax evasion. The authorities don't like that at all!
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: danknugsdun on December 21, 2012, 01:13 am
I think I understand where you're coming from as bitcoins are anonymous but your surface cashout is subject to taxation from the IRS/HMRC etc... Moreover KYC policies may have you by the short and curlies if you are to vend here. You can be damn sure nobody is going to be sending you identification.

LE won't be coming to you as long as you pay your taxes and operate legitimately. Although, that does beg the question as to wether you will be cashing the BTC's legitimately or laundering them.

Just be careful with the addresses you give out for cash mails. Use different drops every month/2 months whatever. Stay safe!

Dank
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: zazoo on December 21, 2012, 01:17 am
Maybe you should ask Vlad1mir. 8)
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: bludsrevenge on December 21, 2012, 01:42 am
Using drops adds a different question. How do you pick up. Any LEO can buy my listing and stake outside of the mailbox which I sent it. They just wait for me to show up and collect than they catch me. How can I do a, you send me cash I send you BTC without getting caught.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: Master Reaper on December 21, 2012, 02:15 am
Bludsrevenge, I PM'd you about the racetams.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: wretched on December 21, 2012, 02:32 am
By using SR to offer even a legal service, you are still using a site that is in the business of drug distribution, and if you are in the US, they will definitely be able to charge you with something similar to the conspiracy charges that the TFM money handlers were charged with. Being a financial exchange on a site that was built on an illegal empire is taking part in that illegal empire, so I suggest not giving out your actual address.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: Havacle on December 21, 2012, 03:15 am
I have read that there is a federal law that makes it a crime to have a membership on a site such as this. I do not know first hand that it's true, but take it for what you will. I do think wretched is correct, and it's pretty much a no-brainer to think that you could certainly be charged with drug money laundering. If they decided to attack that way.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: danknugsdun on December 21, 2012, 03:21 am
Evidence is needed to convict. How can LE prove that the BTC's this guy is cashing was from criminal gains. Granted, it would certainly look that way to a judge but still physical evidence that the funds cash were from an illegitimate source is needed.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: Magic Moments on December 21, 2012, 03:29 am
I dont know where you're located, but ask yourself this question before you start. Are any of the big guys doing it? Mtgox, bitfloor, bitstamp, cavirtex, canadianbitcoins ect.
The answer is no. They are not on here advertising their services because it IS illigal to sell bitcoins on this site, the police will most likely kick in your door and try to gather evidence against you for assisting in drug transactions. Forget the tax issues, that would be the least of your concern.

If you want to buy or sell BTC do it on the clearweb and dont advertise on Silk Road.

Magic
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: wretched on December 21, 2012, 03:49 am
Evidence is needed to convict. How can LE prove that the BTC's this guy is cashing was from criminal gains. Granted, it would certainly look that way to a judge but still physical evidence that the funds cash were from an illegitimate source is needed.

I would imagine that the fact that he paid a fee to become a vendor on SR proves that he is funding a drug operation with his business regardless of if they can prove any single bitcoin was FROM an illegitimate source, hence my fear of a conspiracy charge.


Forget the tax issues, that would be the least of your concern.


I guess you should ask Al Capone if the tax issue should be worried about.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: Magic Moments on December 21, 2012, 03:52 am
Evidence is needed to convict. How can LE prove that the BTC's this guy is cashing was from criminal gains. Granted, it would certainly look that way to a judge but still physical evidence that the funds cash were from an illegitimate source is needed.

I would imagine that the fact that he paid a fee to become a vendor on SR proves that he is funding a drug operation with his business regardless of if they can prove any single bitcoin was FROM an illegitimate source, hence my fear of a conspiracy charge.


Forget the tax issues, that would be the least of your concern.


I guess you should ask Al Capone if the tax issue should be worried about.

I'm not saying that they wont come after you for tax reasons, but the reason they went after Mr Capone and others like Meyer Lansky is because they couldn't  charge them with anything else. If they had the goods on Al then he would have went away for murder or bootlegging, and not the tax evasion that the pigs finally got him on.

Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: danknugsdun on December 21, 2012, 04:01 am
Evidence is needed to convict. How can LE prove that the BTC's this guy is cashing was from criminal gains. Granted, it would certainly look that way to a judge but still physical evidence that the funds cash were from an illegitimate source is needed.

I would imagine that the fact that he paid a fee to become a vendor on SR proves that he is funding a drug operation with his business regardless of if they can prove any single bitcoin was FROM an illegitimate source, hence my fear of a conspiracy charge.


Understandable. Although conspiracy charges still need some form of evidence any money that has changed hands has been provided by illegitimate activities.

If he didn't turn over his transaction histories then I assume he would be charged on conspiracy to launder. Even still, law can be very different in different countries.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: 46&2 on December 22, 2012, 06:38 pm
I think it would be illegal because of tax evasion. The authorities don't like that at all!

in that case, wouldn't your local classified ad sellers of household items have the feds banging down their doors ???
i think that kind of tax evasion is overlooked :)
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: sunny1 on December 24, 2012, 10:42 pm
It depends on what the feds want to do and how the headline will look. "silk road money changer caught" is a nifty headline and if they can nail him on overtime parking the judge will throw the book at him. There is always some law they can dig up. If they charge him with 50 felonies and offer to drop all but 1 with a short sentence, it will be hard to turn down. Even more so if his lawyer says the jury may decide to convict on all 50.

Bottom line is; dont do it.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: financeguy on January 07, 2013, 02:08 am
I can't see how it can be illegal. All you are doing is creating an account on a website and selling your legitimate products. Just like Ebay, Craigslist, etc.
Just because the websites moderators choose not to edit its contents, how can that be the fault of the Vendor?
As long as you declare your income like you would any other way, your not doing anything wrong.

Just because 1 person on your train is carrying drugs, does that make you guilty?
Just because 90% of the people on the train are carrying drugs and your not, does that make you guilty?


Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: Boomer23 on January 09, 2013, 02:06 am
I'm sure I'm missing something here, but if the service you're offering is legit, why not just use Ebay, Craigslist, or your own site out in the clearnet

You're not the only one buying and selling btc out there.

Why do you want to use SR?

Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: financeguy on January 09, 2013, 07:43 am
@Boomer,

It would be beneficial to sell complimentary products to a target audience.
Title: Re: Is it illegal to vend legal products on the road?
Post by: valakki on January 10, 2013, 05:14 pm
why dont you make use a clearnet website instead? maybe you could do this on ebay ?