Silk Road forums

Discussion => Philosophy, Economics and Justice => Topic started by: KintaroBC on August 09, 2013, 02:53 am

Title: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: KintaroBC on August 09, 2013, 02:53 am
I have a theory that nbombs remain legal because if they ban them, they advertise the glorious NBOMe class of substances. Quite a pickle for them, isn't it? With the stocks I'm bringing in, I don't know if I'll care that the Government puts the price up. It's hard selling something people know nothing about, something which hasn't been said to be bad by our enemies.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: heatcheck on August 09, 2013, 04:55 am
I think they are illegal a lot of places. Probably fall under the analogue act in the US or something like it elsewhere.

Even if they aren't, its because a gov't is moving slowly. Not some sort of conspiracy.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: KintaroBC on August 09, 2013, 05:51 am
Wasn't suggesting a conspiracy, but it doesn't even in tests mandated by the Govt here in Australia for urine drug screening. If they change anything in the law, we all here about it, and it works like advertising. It's just a problem all politicians face, and I find it interesting. It's quite a pickle always being a mooching asshole unwilling to face reality. It's just like a liars crux.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 09, 2013, 06:03 am
nbomes are pretty lame, and they are some of the more dangerous psychedelics we have access to in my opinion.

yeah they are good money makers but they definitely dont provide divine experiences like real psychedelics do.  :P

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: KintaroBC on August 09, 2013, 06:12 am
I find them perfect, I don't believe in divine experiences, and I don't want an emotional high. I don't mind if people do, but quite frankly they're safer and not emotionally intense. Maybe that is because I'm a cold motherfucker.

I've done so much LSD that I'm sick of it.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: fordingtheharrison on August 09, 2013, 06:19 am
Governments just haven't caught on to them yet, but it's taken the attention of a few countries/states (Russia, UK, etc., what Wikipedia and Erowid say). The US government would mostly likely regard the NBOMe series as analogues of the 2C series under the Analogue Act, but a provision in the act makes the chemicals in question legal as long as they're not for human consumption, and the government is possibly okay with leaving it in this gray zone for now. It's not big enough to be a priority.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 09, 2013, 03:00 pm
I find them perfect, I don't believe in divine experiences, and I don't want an emotional high. I don't mind if people do, but quite frankly they're safer and not emotionally intense. Maybe that is because I'm a cold motherfucker.

I've done so much LSD that I'm sick of it.
I know people that are emotionally scarred from nbomes, to the point that every drug they have taken after there nbome experience has been affected.

not sure how you could possibly call them safer and feel good about that statement hahaha.
nbomes are dangerous both physically and mentally in my opinion.

nbomes are filthy.... and if you take psyches just to have fun your brain is going to get twisted because you arent taking the experience as seriously as you should.

but thats just my opinion, not a fact or anything! I just really dont like them  :P

maybe they want it to stay legal so every drug hungry kid that wants to take research chemicals will die off?  ;D
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: KintaroBC on August 09, 2013, 04:31 pm
I've unrepressed an entire oedipus complex beating off on pure MDPV for hours on end, but only because I was stupid enough to believe Freud.

We can think straight again, we can do it, as beings of open conceptualization we never have to be stuck. It all just takes an open mind, and a mindful regard for set and setting.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: moonflower on August 09, 2013, 09:51 pm
I find them perfect, I don't believe in divine experiences, and I don't want an emotional high. I don't mind if people do, but quite frankly they're safer and not emotionally intense. Maybe that is because I'm a cold motherfucker.

I've done so much LSD that I'm sick of it.
I know people that are emotionally scarred from nbomes, to the point that every drug they have taken after there nbome experience has been affected.

not sure how you could possibly call them safer and feel good about that statement hahaha.
nbomes are dangerous both physically and mentally in my opinion.

nbomes are filthy.... and if you take psyches just to have fun your brain is going to get twisted because you arent taking the experience as seriously as you should.

but thats just my opinion, not a fact or anything! I just really dont like them  :P

maybe they want it to stay legal so every drug hungry kid that wants to take research chemicals will die off?  ;D
so true! 25i just feels like straight up poison to me. it literally made me feel like my visual cortex was frying. my girlfriend is still afraid of psychedelics because of that single trip. do not underestimate the power of the nbomes, it's not all fun and games. if you value your health, do your mind and body a favor and take real psychedelics.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: KintaroBC on August 10, 2013, 08:51 am
If you drift through life without judging what you see, your consciousness becomes cluttered, and drugs can make you put that junk together in strange ways ending in disaster. It's not rocket since, you are what you know. Never blame the psychoactives.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: HeatFireFlame on August 10, 2013, 10:02 am
Nbombe Is now a class B substance in the UK. They made no major headlines about it, just a small column in a newspaper on page 8 or something, No big deal, so as to not attract any attention.However apparently it is only a temporary ban for a Year until "more research" is done.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: fiendish on August 13, 2013, 12:50 pm
The NBOMs have been attracting a lot of bad publicity in Australia relating to teenagers taking them and doing stupid things like jumping off balconies and dying. The press calls them synthetic LSD and connects them to drug on the net penomena. In fact I'm pretty sure one State passed emergency legislation to ban them. Though I'd have thought they were illegal anyway as 2C analogues.
I personally don't mind them when partying with a few drinks but can understand people into the real psychelics not enjoying them.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 13, 2013, 01:20 pm
I find them perfect, I don't believe in divine experiences, and I don't want an emotional high. I don't mind if people do, but quite frankly they're safer and not emotionally intense. Maybe that is because I'm a cold motherfucker.

I've done so much LSD that I'm sick of it.
I know people that are emotionally scarred from nbomes, to the point that every drug they have taken after there nbome experience has been affected.

not sure how you could possibly call them safer and feel good about that statement hahaha.
nbomes are dangerous both physically and mentally in my opinion.

nbomes are filthy.... and if you take psyches just to have fun your brain is going to get twisted because you arent taking the experience as seriously as you should.

but thats just my opinion, not a fact or anything! I just really dont like them  :P

maybe they want it to stay legal so every drug hungry kid that wants to take research chemicals will die off?  ;D
so true! 25i just feels like straight up poison to me. it literally made me feel like my visual cortex was frying. my girlfriend is still afraid of psychedelics because of that single trip. do not underestimate the power of the nbomes, it's not all fun and games. if you value your health, do your mind and body a favor and take real psychedelics.

Quoting this out of relevance, and it really hits home for me.  Moonflower, you couldn't be more correct.
Here is my 25I-NBOMe experience broken down.
Cross posting this for harm reduction/knowledge and AMA.

I would be extremely careful with the stuff. The safety profile is beyond sketchy.
Even though a large percentage of people can "safely" use this substance.
There is also an equally important percentage of people that will suffer grave side effects.

25I-NBOMe is easily the most toxic thing I've ever ingested.
Had the absolute worst trip of my life because of it.
500ug's of blotter and had some type of reaction, overdosed, tripped harder than anything I've ever experienced, then completely lost consciousness.
What was soon followed by a series of grand mal seizures, landing me in the hospital.
For some reason my body just plain rejects it.  It's like vile poison coursing thorough my veins.
I believe to my body it's strongly hepatoxic, as well as cardiotoxic.
It's nasty, nasty stuff.
The entire experience and side effects were some of the worst I've experienced.
Almost too many to list.

Plus it was 50 cents that ended up almost costing me both my life and $3k in medical bills.
The risk to reward ratio is screwed up here.
It's also the one and only psychedelic or drug in general to ever give me a seizure, and I have done plenty.
That alone says something.

Thought that I would never recover from something like this.
But it was possible because of SR and it's been a triumphant return to glory.
*Rise and Return of Vanquish*
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=45270.msg1395142#msg1395142

Please, be extremely careful with this stuff.
For harm reduction sake this is some of the worst stuff you can touch.
You play with fire, and you get burnt.
This substance takes it to the next level.
Even if this keeps one person from having to go through what I experienced it will be well worth posting this.

Best Regards,
Vanquish
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Tyl3rdurden on August 14, 2013, 09:33 pm
When we first started our business we had no idea what would happen – 25i may well have turned out to be a fantastic chemical with a great safety profile. I was enthusiastic and keen to share with everyone.

Whether we admit it or not, today NBOMe's are causing harm to people
At first the reports of negative effects coming back were from unknown contributors but there are a growing number of respected board members denouncing this substance, both here and on Bluelight.

NBOMes are to true LSD what mephedrone was to MDMA - a cheap, untested replacement which, with time, has produced a plethora of negative reports and hospitalisations.
NBOMes are occasionally causing seizures, and (I speculate) regularly causing psychological damage.

I can justify to myself over and over that people should have the freedom to do as they please, and that we are not responsible for what happens once it leaves our hands, but the truth is that 90% of people out there don't have the knowledge to make an informed decision.
I do have this knowledge and I would choose not to take these substances any more.

I can no longer supply this chemical and be happy, knowing that despite our best efforts, it can and will end up in the hands of those who are likely to use it irresponsibly - and even those who do, may have unpredictable reactions to it with lasting effects.

We have made the decision to destroy everything and move on with our lives.

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 14, 2013, 10:19 pm
When we first started our business we had no idea what would happen – 25i may well have turned out to be a fantastic chemical with a great safety profile. I was enthusiastic and keen to share with everyone.

Whether we admit it or not, today NBOMe's are causing harm to people
At first the reports of negative effects coming back were from unknown contributors but there are a growing number of respected board members denouncing this substance, both here and on Bluelight.

NBOMes are to true LSD what mephedrone was to MDMA - a cheap, untested replacement which, with time, has produced a plethora of negative reports and hospitalisations.
NBOMes are occasionally causing seizures, and (I speculate) regularly causing psychological damage.

I can justify to myself over and over that people should have the freedom to do as they please, and that we are not responsible for what happens once it leaves our hands, but the truth is that 90% of people out there don't have the knowledge to make an informed decision.
I do have this knowledge and I would choose not to take these substances any more.

I can no longer supply this chemical and be happy, knowing that despite our best efforts, it can and will end up in the hands of those who are likely to use it irresponsibly - and even those who do, may have unpredictable reactions to it with lasting effects.

We have made the decision to destroy everything and move on with our lives.

Major respect for you Mr. Durden. Eloquently and accurately said, and I agree whole heartily.
+1
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Tyl3rdurden on August 14, 2013, 11:03 pm
On the plus side these new lysergamides look pretty neat huh?
If we could only find the source...
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 15, 2013, 05:30 am
On the plus side these new lysergamides look pretty neat huh?
If we could only find the source...
Hey Tyler,

Found this latest information on them from envioso, looks like a one and done batch.
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=186046.msg1451568#msg1451568

At the rate we are going we can expect to see dozens and dozens of new RC's pop up in the next few years.
Sad thing is it's always to stay ahead of law making and profiteering - while becoming a modern day epidemic.
That's why Silk Road and everything it stands for is that much more important.

Vanquish
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: HeatFireFlame on August 15, 2013, 06:14 pm
On the plus side these new lysergamides look pretty neat huh?
If we could only find the source...
Hey Tyler,

Found this latest information on them from envioso, looks like a one and done batch.
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=186046.msg1451568#msg1451568

At the rate we are going we can expect to see dozens and dozens of new RC's pop up in the next few years.
Sad thing is it's always to stay ahead of law making and profiteering - while becoming a modern day epidemic.
That's why Silk Road and everything it stands for is that much more important.

Vanquish

Unfortunately I would have to agree, We seem to be veering toward RC's becoming more and more dominant, When the vast majority of the time the things they imitate are much better for you than the rc's.
For instance, Look at "smoking blends" meant to imitate weed, everyone with a mind knows weed is 1000 times better for your body, Especially seeing as it is only a plant.
Nbombe is much worse for you than LSD, Which does much less damage in every way.
Mepehdrone is much worse for you than MDMA, and the list goes on.
As long as the government wants to keep these things illegal, and the legal highs which are worse for you legal, People are going to continue to be harmed by these substances.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on August 16, 2013, 03:14 am
When we first started our business we had no idea what would happen – 25i may well have turned out to be a fantastic chemical with a great safety profile. I was enthusiastic and keen to share with everyone.

Whether we admit it or not, today NBOMe's are causing harm to people
At first the reports of negative effects coming back were from unknown contributors but there are a growing number of respected board members denouncing this substance, both here and on Bluelight.

NBOMes are to true LSD what mephedrone was to MDMA - a cheap, untested replacement which, with time, has produced a plethora of negative reports and hospitalisations.
NBOMes are occasionally causing seizures, and (I speculate) regularly causing psychological damage.

I can justify to myself over and over that people should have the freedom to do as they please, and that we are not responsible for what happens once it leaves our hands, but the truth is that 90% of people out there don't have the knowledge to make an informed decision.
I do have this knowledge and I would choose not to take these substances any more.

I can no longer supply this chemical and be happy, knowing that despite our best efforts, it can and will end up in the hands of those who are likely to use it irresponsibly - and even those who do, may have unpredictable reactions to it with lasting effects.

We have made the decision to destroy everything and move on with our lives.

Wow. 

I bought a bunch of these NBOMEs (25c, 25i, 25e, 25d) (I think actually even some from you) a while ago and was holding onto it with a little fear and anticipation of eventually consuming some but I think you've just convinced me not to even try it ever.

Does anyone think DOC/DOM have similar effects?  I was really excited to try DOM as my next big trip out sometime in the future and have read a lot of good things about it.  Not sure why I feel its similar in my mind to NBOME maybe just because same vendors selling it.

I've read about people OD'ing on DOM from taking too much but no other crazy things like seizures.  Any info on that would be appreciated.

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: moonflower on August 16, 2013, 09:27 pm
When we first started our business we had no idea what would happen – 25i may well have turned out to be a fantastic chemical with a great safety profile. I was enthusiastic and keen to share with everyone.

Whether we admit it or not, today NBOMe's are causing harm to people
At first the reports of negative effects coming back were from unknown contributors but there are a growing number of respected board members denouncing this substance, both here and on Bluelight.

NBOMes are to true LSD what mephedrone was to MDMA - a cheap, untested replacement which, with time, has produced a plethora of negative reports and hospitalisations.
NBOMes are occasionally causing seizures, and (I speculate) regularly causing psychological damage.

I can justify to myself over and over that people should have the freedom to do as they please, and that we are not responsible for what happens once it leaves our hands, but the truth is that 90% of people out there don't have the knowledge to make an informed decision.
I do have this knowledge and I would choose not to take these substances any more.

I can no longer supply this chemical and be happy, knowing that despite our best efforts, it can and will end up in the hands of those who are likely to use it irresponsibly - and even those who do, may have unpredictable reactions to it with lasting effects.

We have made the decision to destroy everything and move on with our lives.

Wow. 

I bought a bunch of these NBOMEs (25c, 25i, 25e, 25d) (I think actually even some from you) a while ago and was holding onto it with a little fear and anticipation of eventually consuming some but I think you've just convinced me not to even try it ever.

Does anyone think DOC/DOM have similar effects?  I was really excited to try DOM as my next big trip out sometime in the future and have read a lot of good things about it.  Not sure why I feel its similar in my mind to NBOME maybe just because same vendors selling it.

I've read about people OD'ing on DOM from taking too much but no other crazy things like seizures.  Any info on that would be appreciated.
dom is quite a bit safer than 25i. it's been around for over 40 years as opposed to 25i, which has only existed for 10 years. as with any new chemical, be sure to do your research on dosing and effects.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on August 16, 2013, 11:19 pm
dom is quite a bit safer than 25i. it's been around for over 40 years as opposed to 25i, which has only existed for 10 years. as with any new chemical, be sure to do your research on dosing and effects.

Thanks for the reply.  I have done a decent amount of research on DOM and that is why I am excited about it.

But I also did a decent amount of research on NBOME and did not hear about seizure reports; so now I am just kind of spooked in general about RCs.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 19, 2013, 11:47 am
Does anyone have any source for this other an anecdotal evidence? (well written trip reports, knowing the exact dose, not mixing drugs etc)

Me and 3 friends took it the other week and I thought it was amazing. Better than LSD (which I have taken 50+ times). It was just a very strong visual high with a clear head. I'm finding it surprising so there are people having negative side-effects? Are they just inexperienced? Are they sure they're taking the dosage they think they are? Mixing it with other drugs? I took 1mg and I'll probably take 2mg next time
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: HeatFireFlame on August 19, 2013, 05:51 pm
Does anyone have any source for this other an anecdotal evidence? (well written trip reports, knowing the exact dose, not mixing drugs etc)

Me and 3 friends took it the other week and I thought it was amazing. Better than LSD (which I have taken 50+ times). It was just a very strong visual high with a clear head. I'm finding it surprising so there are people having negative side-effects? Are they just inexperienced? Are they sure they're taking the dosage they think they are? Mixing it with other drugs? I took 1mg and I'll probably take 2mg next time

Personally, I have been around the road long enough now to have seen the "rise and fall of nbome". While it still sells fairly well, What I mean by the rise and fall of it is that for a short period of time I think some people actually thought it may well be a substitute for LSD, which it simply is not. Nothing is ever as good as the original in my opinion.

I have tried Nbome 3 times, Once it was 25i Nbome, I had 3 1200ug tabs, Stupid I know, But I did, Anyway, It was a good trip but it had a "dodgy feeling" to it, A Chemical feeling that LSD just does not have.
The second time I tried 25cNbome and it was just nowhere near as good as LSD, and not as good as the 25i.  It just was not up to much, It felt as if it was trying to "fake" the hallucinations. Nothing was as clear, There certainly was not any sort of spiritual awareness to it and it just seemed cheap really.
The last time I tried mixing 25c and 25i and I did not enjoy it at all, It felt like a poison in my body and I decided I was never taking Nbome again.

I can see young teenagers up to about 16 years old enjoying it, possibly buying it in larger amounts because of the price however in my opinion, It does not match up to LSD in any way shape or form, or any other hallucinogen, such as cacti, magic mushrooms or mescalin.

As for what your asking about anecdotal evidence, There is none. Or very little if there is, Nbome is a fairly new substance, Around 10 years old I think and only really came to light majorly a few years back.
people get their evidence from in depth reading of trip reports, And through threads like this. If there is any community in the world that can diagnose bad substances, It is the SR community.
I saw the thread with you discussing this topic with SynthesisWizard as well , I have to say im siding with him on this one.

Be carefull with nbome, it may seem good because it is cheap, But would it be worth it if it did long lasting damage to your body, or your friends?
There may not be scientific evidence to prove this yet, But Is there scientific evidence to prove otherwise?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: HCeline on August 19, 2013, 06:10 pm
I think we need to stop thinking about rc's as replacements for other drugs.  Think of them as what they are unique drugs with thier own novel effects.   The nbome series of chemical to me seems to be a far more recreational experience when used safely.  The biggest problem I've seen is you get people who think they can take as much as they want.  Their always the one who it seems have a problem.  The nbome series is super selective at a very few number of receptors, and it seems will overstimulate those receptors quickly with heavy use.  People need to take that into consideration, with L it is so promiscuous your not really focusing on any one receptor and any strain is spread out.  Every one knows that you are supposed to use lsd sparingly to give your brain a time to recover.  Well just think how much more time is needed when its just a few receptors that did all that craziness.  The problem I see with most of the new psychedelic rc's is that they were invented to do mapping studies of very specific neurons.  We need some promiscuous molecules made for recreation. 
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 19, 2013, 07:31 pm
Does anyone have any source for this other an anecdotal evidence? (well written trip reports, knowing the exact dose, not mixing drugs etc)

Me and 3 friends took it the other week and I thought it was amazing. Better than LSD (which I have taken 50+ times). It was just a very strong visual high with a clear head. I'm finding it surprising so there are people having negative side-effects? Are they just inexperienced? Are they sure they're taking the dosage they think they are? Mixing it with other drugs? I took 1mg and I'll probably take 2mg next time

Personally, I have been around the road long enough now to have seen the "rise and fall of nbome". While it still sells fairly well, What I mean by the rise and fall of it is that for a short period of time I think some people actually thought it may well be a substitute for LSD, which it simply is not. Nothing is ever as good as the original in my opinion.

I have tried Nbome 3 times, Once it was 25i Nbome, I had 3 1200ug tabs, Stupid I know, But I did, Anyway, It was a good trip but it had a "dodgy feeling" to it, A Chemical feeling that LSD just does not have.
The second time I tried 25cNbome and it was just nowhere near as good as LSD, and not as good as the 25i.  It just was not up to much, It felt as if it was trying to "fake" the hallucinations. Nothing was as clear, There certainly was not any sort of spiritual awareness to it and it just seemed cheap really.
The last time I tried mixing 25c and 25i and I did not enjoy it at all, It felt like a poison in my body and I decided I was never taking Nbome again.

I can see young teenagers up to about 16 years old enjoying it, possibly buying it in larger amounts because of the price however in my opinion, It does not match up to LSD in any way shape or form, or any other hallucinogen, such as cacti, magic mushrooms or mescalin.

As for what your asking about anecdotal evidence, There is none. Or very little if there is, Nbome is a fairly new substance, Around 10 years old I think and only really came to light majorly a few years back.
people get their evidence from in depth reading of trip reports, And through threads like this. If there is any community in the world that can diagnose bad substances, It is the SR community.
I saw the thread with you discussing this topic with SynthesisWizard as well , I have to say im siding with him on this one.

Be carefull with nbome, it may seem good because it is cheap, But would it be worth it if it did long lasting damage to your body, or your friends?
There may not be scientific evidence to prove this yet, But Is there scientific evidence to prove otherwise?

I've been in the scene for 8 years - other chemicals that ARE dangerous we found out about very quickly. For example, mephedrone. NBOMe was popularised in 2010 - if it was as dangerous as you're saying then itd be a lot more well known.  I think the issue comes from people like you 3.6mg for your first dose for a new chemical. are you insane? It's not LSD (I thought it was better - less headfuck. Nicer visuals). Don't treat it as such
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: shankman96 on August 19, 2013, 09:05 pm
Does anyone have any source for this other an anecdotal evidence? (well written trip reports, knowing the exact dose, not mixing drugs etc)

Me and 3 friends took it the other week and I thought it was amazing. Better than LSD (which I have taken 50+ times). It was just a very strong visual high with a clear head. I'm finding it surprising so there are people having negative side-effects? Are they just inexperienced? Are they sure they're taking the dosage they think they are? Mixing it with other drugs? I took 1mg and I'll probably take 2mg next time

Personally, I have been around the road long enough now to have seen the "rise and fall of nbome". While it still sells fairly well, What I mean by the rise and fall of it is that for a short period of time I think some people actually thought it may well be a substitute for LSD, which it simply is not. Nothing is ever as good as the original in my opinion.

I have tried Nbome 3 times, Once it was 25i Nbome, I had 3 1200ug tabs, Stupid I know, But I did, Anyway, It was a good trip but it had a "dodgy feeling" to it, A Chemical feeling that LSD just does not have.
The second time I tried 25cNbome and it was just nowhere near as good as LSD, and not as good as the 25i.  It just was not up to much, It felt as if it was trying to "fake" the hallucinations. Nothing was as clear, There certainly was not any sort of spiritual awareness to it and it just seemed cheap really.
The last time I tried mixing 25c and 25i and I did not enjoy it at all, It felt like a poison in my body and I decided I was never taking Nbome again.

I can see young teenagers up to about 16 years old enjoying it, possibly buying it in larger amounts because of the price however in my opinion, It does not match up to LSD in any way shape or form, or any other hallucinogen, such as cacti, magic mushrooms or mescalin.

As for what your asking about anecdotal evidence, There is none. Or very little if there is, Nbome is a fairly new substance, Around 10 years old I think and only really came to light majorly a few years back.
people get their evidence from in depth reading of trip reports, And through threads like this. If there is any community in the world that can diagnose bad substances, It is the SR community.
I saw the thread with you discussing this topic with SynthesisWizard as well , I have to say im siding with him on this one.

Be carefull with nbome, it may seem good because it is cheap, But would it be worth it if it did long lasting damage to your body, or your friends?
There may not be scientific evidence to prove this yet, But Is there scientific evidence to prove otherwise?

I've been in the scene for 8 years - other chemicals that ARE dangerous we found out about very quickly. For example, mephedrone. NBOMe was popularised in 2010 - if it was as dangerous as you're saying then itd be a lot more well known.  I think the issue comes from people like you 3.6mg for your first dose for a new chemical. are you insane? It's not LSD (I thought it was better - less headfuck. Nicer visuals). Don't treat it as such

Thank you for this. I had 1mg of 25i/c (don't remember which) my first time and it was so fucking amazing, no bad side effects at all. If you're not fucking retarded, it's safe. Moderation is key.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: GGGreenbud on August 19, 2013, 09:35 pm
    The obvious answer to this problem, is to decrease the price of, or legalize, LSD.  Perhaps we will see more of these new, novel, lysergamides? most of the people I know who tried AL-LAD or LSZ liked it almost as much, eventually there will be so many drugs out there, 2000 per year by 2020(according to shulgin himself) that we really will have "a drug for everyone", if NBOMe's aren't your bag, find something that is, and do baby doses.  I keep hearing about vaporization as a route of admin with NBOMe, it sounds like a good idea so people don't get it confused with acid- because LSD won't vape and NBOMe will.  Still, there could be residue, 3mg of residue from multiple uses would appear small, yet could cook someone.  Eh, I think they'll just ban them as they come along, eventually the bans won't make any sense, there will be too many compounds, and the newer drugs will replace the old.  The main difference now, is that there are 100x as many chemists and a flourishing culture of psychedelics going back 120+ years in western culture, if you consider mescaline, and other cultures back to the beginning of time.  They found a mushroom man sculpture in the Sahara going back pre-10000BC, and there are 40,000yo etchings of Echinopsis Peruvianus in the Atacalma desert in Peru.  The genie is out of the bottle, Alice fell down the rabbit hole, and there is no going back! no one gets out of here alive!
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: HeatFireFlame on August 19, 2013, 10:59 pm
Does anyone have any source for this other an anecdotal evidence? (well written trip reports, knowing the exact dose, not mixing drugs etc)

Me and 3 friends took it the other week and I thought it was amazing. Better than LSD (which I have taken 50+ times). It was just a very strong visual high with a clear head. I'm finding it surprising so there are people having negative side-effects? Are they just inexperienced? Are they sure they're taking the dosage they think they are? Mixing it with other drugs? I took 1mg and I'll probably take 2mg next time

Personally, I have been around the road long enough now to have seen the "rise and fall of nbome". While it still sells fairly well, What I mean by the rise and fall of it is that for a short period of time I think some people actually thought it may well be a substitute for LSD, which it simply is not. Nothing is ever as good as the original in my opinion.

I have tried Nbome 3 times, Once it was 25i Nbome, I had 3 1200ug tabs, Stupid I know, But I did, Anyway, It was a good trip but it had a "dodgy feeling" to it, A Chemical feeling that LSD just does not have.
The second time I tried 25cNbome and it was just nowhere near as good as LSD, and not as good as the 25i.  It just was not up to much, It felt as if it was trying to "fake" the hallucinations. Nothing was as clear, There certainly was not any sort of spiritual awareness to it and it just seemed cheap really.
The last time I tried mixing 25c and 25i and I did not enjoy it at all, It felt like a poison in my body and I decided I was never taking Nbome again.

I can see young teenagers up to about 16 years old enjoying it, possibly buying it in larger amounts because of the price however in my opinion, It does not match up to LSD in any way shape or form, or any other hallucinogen, such as cacti, magic mushrooms or mescalin.

As for what your asking about anecdotal evidence, There is none. Or very little if there is, Nbome is a fairly new substance, Around 10 years old I think and only really came to light majorly a few years back.
people get their evidence from in depth reading of trip reports, And through threads like this. If there is any community in the world that can diagnose bad substances, It is the SR community.
I saw the thread with you discussing this topic with SynthesisWizard as well , I have to say im siding with him on this one.

Be carefull with nbome, it may seem good because it is cheap, But would it be worth it if it did long lasting damage to your body, or your friends?
There may not be scientific evidence to prove this yet, But Is there scientific evidence to prove otherwise?

I've been in the scene for 8 years - other chemicals that ARE dangerous we found out about very quickly. For example, mephedrone. NBOMe was popularised in 2010 - if it was as dangerous as you're saying then itd be a lot more well known.  I think the issue comes from people like you 3.6mg for your first dose for a new chemical. are you insane? It's not LSD (I thought it was better - less headfuck. Nicer visuals). Don't treat it as such
As I said it was stupid, I did state that clearly, But that is not why I didnt like it, It was to do with the times I tried it afterwards that made me not like it. It is not a smart thing to do, it was retarded and I admit it, But boy it was a trip.
No, I disagree about it would be more known and about it having more visuals and less of a headfuck than LSD. It is completely the opposite with me, More of a headfuck and less visuals, More to do with peripherals etc. And most of the bad reports do not come in from people taking larger amounts, They come from people who are expericned with other psychadelic compounds and find Nbome to be much worse.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: shankman96 on August 20, 2013, 12:09 am
Almost every terrible trip report I've read were where the person took 30mg or somewhere around that.
The very few that weren't really high doses, the psychoactive wasn't to blame.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: GGGreenbud on August 20, 2013, 12:56 am
Almost every terrible trip report I've read were where the person took 30mg or somewhere around that.
The very few that weren't really high doses, the psychoactive wasn't to blame.
  Mother of god! 8) 30mg of NBOMe? are you sure you didn't mean 3mg?

     FWIW, LSD is NOT as safe as some people think it is, in terms of pure lethality, yes, more people have died from NBOMe, however, the low-range of LSD overdose has been estimated by some physicians, pharmacologists and toxicologists at 14mg.  I think they call it the LDMin or minimum lethal dose, not to be confused with the LD50, which is in the(low) hundreds of milligrams.  I sometimes wonder about the coke-party-gone-bad where 7 people split a gram of xtal LSD that  they ripped off some dealer, and snorted it(thinking it was coke),  in the early 80s.  They all consumed between 100-250mg convulsed and were placed into artificial comas, and all lived, despite consuming massive 1000+ hit overdoses.   The Kentucky man in 1976 comes to mind as well, he probably would have survived the 300mg(estimate) IV dose, literally enough to kill an elephant(they did that once), if he had received proper treatment. 
     NBOMe overdoses might need specialized treatment, right away, kits should be available for EMTs and first responders.
    I've only met a couple people who've been puddled(not intentionally thumbprinted) at 50+ strong doses.  One mate of mine stripped naked, jumped on a woman's back, and was arrested, brought to ER and given treatment.  Another, a woman who was dating an early extreme sports figure, nom nom'd 50 tabs of REALLY strong(purple jesus print circa 1988) to avoid arrest, and was placed into a 3 or 4 day induced coma with sedatives as well, which apparently works, but she convulsed all the way to the ER.  Another person I met in my travels was 'whitewashed' with 250mg xtal LSD(fucked with wrong people) and quickly got treatment, they gave her some mix of risperdol, thorazine or another strong tranquilizer.  She tripped for 36 hours strapped to a hospital bed, unable to move(party!) Imipramine has reportedly been a first-line defense for underground treatment of LSD overdose.  Lesson: if you are going to thumbprint or puddle yourself, work up a tolerance.  The expense of LSD at current market prices keeps most of these accidents from happening, IMO.  I've bought tabs for less than $40/30, that is just too much temptation for some people, at such a low price point, it is almost enabling. 
     The bad thing now, like the aussie commenter mentioned, is adverse NBOMe events leading people to believe that LSD is the drug in question, because it comes on blotter.  Isn't the media great?
 Now that it's $7-$20 a hit, isn't it about time that LSD pills/gels make a comeback? I know microdots are around(awesome job, people!) but something bigger, the size of a tic-tac would be ideal(ever drop 10 microdots on a same-color carpet?) someone make this happen, for the Media's sake so they can blame it on "bad RCs" or some other garbage.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 20, 2013, 10:56 am
Does anyone have any source for this other an anecdotal evidence? (well written trip reports, knowing the exact dose, not mixing drugs etc)

Me and 3 friends took it the other week and I thought it was amazing. Better than LSD (which I have taken 50+ times). It was just a very strong visual high with a clear head. I'm finding it surprising so there are people having negative side-effects? Are they just inexperienced? Are they sure they're taking the dosage they think they are? Mixing it with other drugs? I took 1mg and I'll probably take 2mg next time

Personally, I have been around the road long enough now to have seen the "rise and fall of nbome". While it still sells fairly well, What I mean by the rise and fall of it is that for a short period of time I think some people actually thought it may well be a substitute for LSD, which it simply is not. Nothing is ever as good as the original in my opinion.

I have tried Nbome 3 times, Once it was 25i Nbome, I had 3 1200ug tabs, Stupid I know, But I did, Anyway, It was a good trip but it had a "dodgy feeling" to it, A Chemical feeling that LSD just does not have.
The second time I tried 25cNbome and it was just nowhere near as good as LSD, and not as good as the 25i.  It just was not up to much, It felt as if it was trying to "fake" the hallucinations. Nothing was as clear, There certainly was not any sort of spiritual awareness to it and it just seemed cheap really.
The last time I tried mixing 25c and 25i and I did not enjoy it at all, It felt like a poison in my body and I decided I was never taking Nbome again.

I can see young teenagers up to about 16 years old enjoying it, possibly buying it in larger amounts because of the price however in my opinion, It does not match up to LSD in any way shape or form, or any other hallucinogen, such as cacti, magic mushrooms or mescalin.

As for what your asking about anecdotal evidence, There is none. Or very little if there is, Nbome is a fairly new substance, Around 10 years old I think and only really came to light majorly a few years back.
people get their evidence from in depth reading of trip reports, And through threads like this. If there is any community in the world that can diagnose bad substances, It is the SR community.
I saw the thread with you discussing this topic with SynthesisWizard as well , I have to say im siding with him on this one.

Be carefull with nbome, it may seem good because it is cheap, But would it be worth it if it did long lasting damage to your body, or your friends?
There may not be scientific evidence to prove this yet, But Is there scientific evidence to prove otherwise?

I've been in the scene for 8 years - other chemicals that ARE dangerous we found out about very quickly. For example, mephedrone. NBOMe was popularised in 2010 - if it was as dangerous as you're saying then itd be a lot more well known.  I think the issue comes from people like you 3.6mg for your first dose for a new chemical. are you insane? It's not LSD (I thought it was better - less headfuck. Nicer visuals). Don't treat it as such
As I said it was stupid, I did state that clearly, But that is not why I didnt like it, It was to do with the times I tried it afterwards that made me not like it. It is not a smart thing to do, it was retarded and I admit it, But boy it was a trip.
No, I disagree about it would be more known and about it having more visuals and less of a headfuck than LSD. It is completely the opposite with me, More of a headfuck and less visuals, More to do with peripherals etc. And most of the bad reports do not come in from people taking larger amounts, They come from people who are expericned with other psychadelic compounds and find Nbome to be much worse.

'opposite with you' - exactly! Everyone is different. Some people really don't like LSD but to go around saying it's 'dangerous' and should be avoided with no-proof is irresponsible. It's just as likely LSD-25 could not agree with someone and give them a bad trip.

Now if there's any real evidence of experienced trippers having bad effects (ie; mephedrone. When mephedrone first came out in 2008(?) my old business partner went on a 2 day binge and couldn't walk for 3 weeks. When my friends take it for more than a day or two I can see the vasco-constriction (blue fingertips). But everything I've heard so far is people taking insane amount 3-30mg and then saying it's dangerous. If there is any evidence (I know there won't be scientific studies - but maybe someone from the Advanced Drug Discussion forum on bluelight could shed a light (ie: is fastandbulbous still around?)

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: fiendish on August 20, 2013, 11:24 am
AuraithX it's just as you say, people taking insane doses! I personally took mephedrone daily for more than a year with no ill effects, but rarely binged more than 12 hrs at a time and all was good. For me it was the drug of my choice! But each to their own.
Took 2CI every weekend for a year or so with no major issues except for feeling a bit wrecked the next day on the odd occassion.
As for 25i, have taken it quite regularly on weekends, sometimes 2 x 1200ug in one night. Only ill effect is a cracker of a headache the next day if I don't eat any food at all.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 21, 2013, 02:17 am
Each and every day we are hearing more about the devastating effects of NBOMe's.
We may never see actual scientific studies on them.
But based on anecdotal evidence and the intensity that they are flooding the market.
There is absolutely no denying that we have an epidemic on our hands.
Whether you are Pro-NBOMe or Anti-NBOMe.
The rate in which we will see these stories will increase exponentially over time.

6 hours ago, another 25I-NBOMe horror story has popped up.
*clearnet warning* http://www.reddit.com/r/Drugs/comments/1kr4i1/my_recent_25irelated_hospital_excursion/

At this rate, and given how cheap NBOMe's are to distribute - I don't see this slowing down anytime soon.
While they may be generally "safe" for some people, they are absolute toxins to others.
Whether this is based on brain chemistry or some other unknown factor we may never know.
The truth is that we have never seen a drug this volatile in a very long time.  Psychedelic or otherwise.

Vanquish
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 21, 2013, 08:48 am
Each and every day we are hearing more about the devastating effects of NBOMe's.
We may never see actual scientific studies on them.
But based on anecdotal evidence and the intensity that they are flooding the market.
There is absolutely no denying that we have an epidemic on our hands.
Whether you are Pro-NBOMe or Anti-NBOMe.
The rate in which we will see these stories will increase exponentially over time.

6 hours ago, another 25I-NBOMe horror story has popped up.
*clearnet warning* http://www.reddit.com/r/Drugs/comments/1kr4i1/my_recent_25irelated_hospital_excursion/

At this rate, and given how cheap NBOMe's are to distribute - I don't see this slowing down anytime soon.
While they may be generally "safe" for some people, they are absolute toxins to others.
Whether this is based on brain chemistry or some other unknown factor we may never know.
The truth is that we have never seen a drug this volatile in a very long time.  Psychedelic or otherwise.

Vanquish

If you read the comments, he was coming off Paxil (A SSRI)

Quote
SSRIs can drastically effect the serotonin system, how they affect the 5HT2 system is relatively well understood(the same system as 25i works on), what isn't exactly clear, although has been postulated, is how they work on the 5HT1 receptors, they can make them terribly unpredictable through de-sensitization. Basically, if you load you HT2a/b/c receptors, your HT1a/b/d/e receptors can become problematic when taking psychedelics, because they also play a role in the function of most psychedelics, although I think 25i is mostly an HT2a drug, the lack of 5HT1 stimulation, like you would have with shrooms or LSD, can cause serious problems, as can overstimulation of these circuits with strong agonists.


Quote
The truth is that we have never seen a drug this volatile in a very long time.  Psychedelic or otherwise.
Erm, yes we have. Mephedrone for one.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 21, 2013, 08:52 am
Each and every day we are hearing more about the devastating effects of NBOMe's.
We may never see actual scientific studies on them.
But based on anecdotal evidence and the intensity that they are flooding the market.
There is absolutely no denying that we have an epidemic on our hands.
Whether you are Pro-NBOMe or Anti-NBOMe.
The rate in which we will see these stories will increase exponentially over time.

6 hours ago, another 25I-NBOMe horror story has popped up.
*clearnet warning* http://www.reddit.com/r/Drugs/comments/1kr4i1/my_recent_25irelated_hospital_excursion/

At this rate, and given how cheap NBOMe's are to distribute - I don't see this slowing down anytime soon.
While they may be generally "safe" for some people, they are absolute toxins to others.
Whether this is based on brain chemistry or some other unknown factor we may never know.
The truth is that we have never seen a drug this volatile in a very long time.  Psychedelic or otherwise.

Vanquish

If you read the comments, he was coming off Paxil (A SSRI)

Quote
SSRIs can drastically effect the serotonin system, how they affect the 5HT2 system is relatively well understood(the same system as 25i works on), what isn't exactly clear, although has been postulated, is how they work on the 5HT1 receptors, they can make them terribly unpredictable through de-sensitization. Basically, if you load you HT2a/b/c receptors, your HT1a/b/d/e receptors can become problematic when taking psychedelics, because they also play a role in the function of most psychedelics, although I think 25i is mostly an HT2a drug, the lack of 5HT1 stimulation, like you would have with shrooms or LSD, can cause serious problems, as can overstimulation of these circuits with strong agonists.


Quote
The truth is that we have never seen a drug this volatile in a very long time.  Psychedelic or otherwise.
Erm, yes we have. Mephedrone for one.

I've been reading bad reports and they all seem to occur with people taking large doses. 3mg+ and most of these people have been on some sort of SSRI. Does anyone know of a report of someone taking a reasonable amount (1-1.5mg) with no other medications and having a bad experience? Because I can't find any.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: T5 on August 23, 2013, 03:56 pm
I think we need to stop thinking about rc's as replacements for other drugs. Think of them as what they are unique drugs with thier own novel effects.   The nbome series of chemical to me seems to be a far more recreational experience when used safely. The biggest problem I've seen is you get people who think they can take as much as they want.  Their always the one who it seems have a problem. The nbome series is super selective at a very few number of receptors, and it seems will overstimulate those receptors quickly with heavy use.  People need to take that into consideration, with L it is so promiscuous your not really focusing on any one receptor and any strain is spread out.  Every one knows that you are supposed to use lsd sparingly to give your brain a time to recover. Well just think how much more time is needed when its just a few receptors that did all that craziness.  The problem I see with most of the new psychedelic rc's is that they were invented to do mapping studies of very specific neurons.  We need some promiscuous molecules made for recreation.

I was not going to quote the whole post, but more people need to read this.
There is a potential for overdose that is present with 25i, but the required dosage to actually put your life in danger is very much high up there, probably around 8 times a mid-heavy dose. While I do have the utmost respect for Tyl3r and his work, and understand his decision to leave the scene and the reasons behind it, I also feel compelled to fill the role of the devil's advocate here.

I feel like a lot of the negative things I read on NBOMe have more to do with its direct impact on the LSD market, and less on how actually threatening to human health the drug itself is. I myself don't think it has a high potential for abuse, and overdosing is never something I have been worried about taking the drug, as I would not stuff 8 tabs in my mouth or take a few NBOMe hits while drinking a lot of alcohol (which has obviously proved a very dangerous mix in the past.)
As for its effect on the LSD market, that is the real crime right here, and in my opinion a good example of one of capitalism's big flaws. 25i is significantly cheaper and easier to produce than LSD, and while it can be argued that it did steal most of its market share from already-established psychedelics it still reaches out to some groups of people that would not necessarily enjoy the LSD experience, as well as drive away others due to its relative shallowness compared to LSD. It definitely has its own defining characteristics, and is in no way "low-tier LSD" in itself, although I do understand why some people would feel that way, and the thought process behind it. Its euphoric effects, flashy visuals and relatively inexpensive costs drove a lot of dealers to turn to NBOMes for their street acid deals and whatnot, and seems to have left a lot of people disappointed in the process (or a few people and many bandwagoners). I would always rather purchase LSD directly off of Silk Road anyway, as street acid can pretty much be nearly anything these days...

As for the actual health concern, we are very aware 25i has been linked to hospitalizations and even deaths in the past, but do believe unreasonable or clearly inappropriate use of the drug was involved in nearly every case. We have dozens of new and returning customers every week, and do exchange quite a lot of messages with them every day, and I have to say that in the entire year we have been doing business here so far we have been reported ONE SINGLE case of hospitalization linked to our products, from a guy that apparently witnessed his friend "get real drunk and take 5 hits". Even if many of the local-level dealers we do business with don't necessarily check in regarding things like that, it is still is a very low percentage considering the amount of tabs we move, which is not at all what you would think reading this thread.

I just feel like if NBOMes really were a new epidemic to stop at all costs, as well as Earth's demise, we would have heard about it by now.



Shag
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 23, 2013, 09:01 pm
Another 25I-NBOMe death.
*clearnet warning* http://www.reddit.com/r/Drugs/comments/1kyqnx/one_of_my_best_friends_who_was_also_a_redditor/

No doubt poly-drug combinations will increase this risk.
Regardless, that doesn't change the fact that the substance has substantial risk involved.
Even if you think you are the most careful person in the world.
The margin of error here isn't even worth the risk of ingesting the substance in the first place.

Just my 2 cents.
I'm not here trying to downplay anyone's opinion or be argumentative.
This will continue, until we can get more definitive proof of its toxicity.
Which each and every day is pointing towards that direction.

Vanquish
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 27, 2013, 11:45 am
I find them perfect, I don't believe in divine experiences, and I don't want an emotional high. I don't mind if people do, but quite frankly they're safer and not emotionally intense. Maybe that is because I'm a cold motherfucker.

I've done so much LSD that I'm sick of it.
I know people that are emotionally scarred from nbomes, to the point that every drug they have taken after there nbome experience has been affected.

not sure how you could possibly call them safer and feel good about that statement hahaha.
nbomes are dangerous both physically and mentally in my opinion.

nbomes are filthy.... and if you take psyches just to have fun your brain is going to get twisted because you arent taking the experience as seriously as you should.

but thats just my opinion, not a fact or anything! I just really dont like them  :P

maybe they want it to stay legal so every drug hungry kid that wants to take research chemicals will die off?  ;D
so true! 25i just feels like straight up poison to me. it literally made me feel like my visual cortex was frying. my girlfriend is still afraid of psychedelics because of that single trip. do not underestimate the power of the nbomes, it's not all fun and games. if you value your health, do your mind and body a favor and take real psychedelics.

Quoting this out of relevance, and it really hits home for me.  Moonflower, you couldn't be more correct.
Here is my 25I-NBOMe experience broken down.
Cross posting this for harm reduction/knowledge and AMA.

I would be extremely careful with the stuff. The safety profile is beyond sketchy.
Even though a large percentage of people can "safely" use this substance.
There is also an equally important percentage of people that will suffer grave side effects.

25I-NBOMe is easily the most toxic thing I've ever ingested.
Had the absolute worst trip of my life because of it.
500ug's of blotter and had some type of reaction, overdosed, tripped harder than anything I've ever experienced, then completely lost consciousness.
What was soon followed by a series of grand mal seizures, landing me in the hospital.
For some reason my body just plain rejects it.  It's like vile poison coursing thorough my veins.
I believe to my body it's strongly hepatoxic, as well as cardiotoxic.
It's nasty, nasty stuff.
The entire experience and side effects were some of the worst I've experienced.
Almost too many to list.

Plus it was 50 cents that ended up almost costing me both my life and $3k in medical bills.
The risk to reward ratio is screwed up here.
It's also the one and only psychedelic or drug in general to ever give me a seizure, and I have done plenty.
That alone says something.

Thought that I would never recover from something like this.
But it was possible because of SR and it's been a triumphant return to glory.
*Rise and Return of Vanquish*
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=45270.msg1395142#msg1395142

Please, be extremely careful with this stuff.
For harm reduction sake this is some of the worst stuff you can touch.
You play with fire, and you get burnt.
This substance takes it to the next level.
Even if this keeps one person from having to go through what I experienced it will be well worth posting this.

Best Regards,
Vanquish


Could you provide more details? Were you on/ever been on SSRIs? There must be an explanation - most likely (cross-tolerance/reaction) or unlikely (some enzyme deficiency that causes it). I've sold 350 nbombs (Selling them AS 25i-NBOMe and telling people to google it) over the past few weeks and I've had 0 negative feedback (So the rate of the deficiency would be lower than 0.0028%)

I actually preferred them to LSD (Less mindfuck, shorter duration, less of a comedown, YMMV)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 27, 2013, 11:50 am
Another 25I-NBOMe death.
*clearnet warning* http://www.reddit.com/r/Drugs/comments/1kyqnx/one_of_my_best_friends_who_was_also_a_redditor/

No doubt poly-drug combinations will increase this risk.
Regardless, that doesn't change the fact that the substance has substantial risk involved.
Even if you think you are the most careful person in the world.
The margin of error here isn't even worth the risk of ingesting the substance in the first place.

Just my 2 cents.
I'm not here trying to downplay anyone's opinion or be argumentative.
This will continue, until we can get more definitive proof of its toxicity.
Which each and every day is pointing towards that direction.

Vanquish

SUSPECTED 25I - Please clarify this. This guy bought acid and said 'It's probably not acid'. It could've been BrDfly for all we know. These are the only CONFIRMED 25i-NBOMe deaths. Please do not spread misinformation - http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/2ci_nbome/2ci_nbome_death.shtml
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 27, 2013, 11:56 am
I have more deaths to report in the past few days, but your negativity makes me not even feel like posting them AuraithX.
It's great that you enjoy NBOMe, more power to you.  I really wish that I could have a wonderful trip for 50 cents as well.
Stop being argumentative man, and chill.

No one here is bashing you or calling you out for your love and enjoyment of NBOMe's.
If you don't like my advice, simply ignore it.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 27, 2013, 12:00 pm
I've been reading bad reports and they all seem to occur with people taking large doses. 3mg+ and most of these people have been on some sort of SSRI. Does anyone know of a report of someone taking a reasonable amount (1-1.5mg) with no other medications and having a bad experience? Because I can't find any.

How about mine for instance, did you ever think to look there?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 27, 2013, 01:18 pm
I've been reading bad reports and they all seem to occur with people taking large doses. 3mg+ and most of these people have been on some sort of SSRI. Does anyone know of a report of someone taking a reasonable amount (1-1.5mg) with no other medications and having a bad experience? Because I can't find any.

How about mine for instance, did you ever think to look there?

Yes, I did - but you never responded to my post.

>Could you provide more details? Were you on/ever been on SSRIs? There must be an explanation - most likely (cross-tolerance/reaction) or unlikely (some enzyme deficiency that causes it). I've sold 350 nbombs (Selling them AS 25i-NBOMe and telling people to google it) over the past few weeks and I've had 0 negative feedback (So the rate of the deficiency would be lower than 0.0028%)

Quote
I have more deaths to report in the past few days, but your negativity makes me not even feel like posting them AuraithX.

Right, well then submit them to the damn erowid vault. Or hub of harm-reduction. Instead of going whining on an online forum. I've yet to see any substantial reasoning behind these incidents.  (Other than extremely high insufflated doses or interactions with SSRIs)


Advising abstinence doesn't work. At all. People will continue you take these, so either you can help spread harm-reduction or sit in your corner with your picket and ignore my posts.

There is no 'negativity' in my post. Please post every incident you have as I've yet to see anything substantial (People taking 500ug-1mg confirmed 25i-NBOMe tab with no drug interactions) and dying. PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 27, 2013, 03:08 pm
There is no 'negativity' in my post. Please post every incident you have as I've yet to see anything substantial (People taking 500ug-1mg confirmed 25i-NBOMe tab with no drug interactions) and dying. PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong.

I had one very experienced friend take a single tab of 600 ug complexed 25b-nbome, and he had a very unpleasant trip. (tweaked out, paranoid, extremely anxious)

Every other person I've seen take nbomes freaks out on the come up. I've sold a few to people and given a few to people, and everyone gives me this look while they are coming up that says
"WHAT THE FUCK DID YOU DO TO ME?!"
It is almost guaranteed to happen, and even if they get over the freakout quickly I don't feel right about giving that to people.

I think that if you are a psychonaut and you have a desire to try all of the rare compounds in existence thats great (I gave that up when I got to the nbomes), I just don't think people who are inexperienced should be taking this substance and thinking they are having a true psychedelic experience.

nbomes are egoboosters, and I dont think it depends on the person because everyone who takes them gets more egotistical while on it.
(seriously, and while I like to stay open-minded, I've seen it way too many times.)

It's just the opposite of what I am looking for in a trip.
they can be fun but they are like cheap, dangerous toys to me.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 27, 2013, 03:41 pm
There is no 'negativity' in my post. Please post every incident you have as I've yet to see anything substantial (People taking 500ug-1mg confirmed 25i-NBOMe tab with no drug interactions) and dying. PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong.

I had one very experienced friend take a single tab of 600 ug complexed 25b-nbome, and he had a very unpleasant trip. (tweaked out, paranoid, extremely anxious)

Every other person I've seen take nbomes freaks out on the come up. I've sold a few to people and given a few to people, and everyone gives me this look while they are coming up that says
"WHAT THE FUCK DID YOU DO TO ME?!"
It is almost guaranteed to happen, and even if they get over the freakout quickly I don't feel right about giving that to people.

I think that if you are a psychonaut and you have a desire to try all of the rare compounds in existence thats great (I gave that up when I got to the nbomes), I just don't think people who are inexperienced should be taking this substance and thinking they are having a true psychedelic experience.

nbomes are egoboosters, and I dont think it depends on the person because everyone who takes them gets more egotistical while on it.
(seriously, and while I like to stay open-minded, I've seen it way too many times.)

It's just the opposite of what I am looking for in a trip.
they can be fun but they are like cheap, dangerous toys to me.

Right, completely anecdotal evidence. I can counter it if you like? Here's mine. (imgur blocks TOR. here's a copy/pasta)

Quote
Customer
cheers mte, all good dropped at 7:55  cheers again mate x

20:11
ME
enjoy mate, feel anything yet? Should start hitting you within the next 20min or so 15-60min after taking if i remember right

20:12
Customer
I man its like tht tinly sensation a bit and ur palms sweat, tastes like fukin pure shite . . . thts how u knw ur getting gd shit  any tips or good stimulants ?

20:12
ME
weed will increase the visuals

20:12
Customer
already on it

20:13
ME
apart from that just sit back and enjoy, its mostly visual not as much as a headfuck as lsd-25
youll prob laugh for 8 hours straight
watch hot-rod. It's on netflix lol

20:13
Customer
nice man nice  al let you know how I get on then my good man lol  sweeeeeet get a bit of a euphoric buzz already, think I grinning

20:20
Customer
kwil question how ng u keep it under ur tongue o bk of gum?

20:20
ME
like 30 mins or so, then chew it up a bit and swallow it
your stomach acid will destroy it so anything left in the tab will be wasted
theyre pretty strong though if you loose a few ug its not a big deal

20:21
Customer
longer better

20:22
ME
i didnt even taste mine, dunno if was an uneven lay or my tastebuds are fucked. willy n fergus said it was horrible and made their lips numb

20:23
Customer
lol sweet bro ai man think u have lost taste!! theses are sooo disgustin man and numby lipps  catchyeh were playin planetside 2 on the big screen should be intereting then gonna chil the fuk out

20:23
ME
lol have fun, good luck trying to do anything but laugh and stare at the walls

20:24
Customer
ooofy literllt just hit me like a ton there fukin a man  spk soonn 

20:54
Customer
if at any point and when would you take more or is it a one hit thing?
I cant imagine its even fully developed but just incase lol

20:55
ME
One hit is plenty for the first time mate lol. 1.5 if you're experienced with acid (10+) trips

20:55
Customer
lol just so no 1 gets hurt lmao

20:56
ME
Every bodies body reacts different to a drug so 1mg is a safe dose. You can take 2 next time if you think you can handle it lol

20:56
Customer
am quite a cautios user thugh  obv am old enuff to knw better
cheers

20:57
ME
It won't have fully bit you yet. About 90min-2hr before the peak

20:57
Customer
Saturday

14:11
ME
Alrite mate. How'd you like them? X
Saturday

18:37
Customer
awryt ma man was fuking lovely   watched tht grown ups 2 couldnt stop laughing the whole time, tripped out a bit, time went so slow as was taking in so many visuals, great length of high as well, very powerful then mellowed out nicely  really really chuffed with it mate, will be purchasing more from you in the near future methinks  went to downtown bout 1 was awsome as well, very similar to swedgers  but slightly wavey near the end, fuly sobered up by bout 7 in the morning. was perfectly fine looking for lunch and the football game today   cant say how chuffed i was mate 10/10 for me  thanks again, cheers for the advice n tht aswell  didnt expect it to be so euphoric which was very pleasant indeed

19:00
ME
Lol sounds quality. Can't believe you went to downtown lol. Like swedgers? Do u mean just the euphoria?

19:19
Customer
ai mate  like duration of high coupled with the euphoria but was more of  a giggly euphoria than a mental one if you ge me ::) really enjoyed, lol a know me n ma pal was nice n trippy and we were so mellowed out, weed helped alot aswell i think

Now, could you get back to providing some real evidence? I've been there when several people have taken it, gotten feedback from everyone who I gave it too (I've sold 350 so there's 350 people without a bad experience). But again, completely anecdotal and means NOTHING. You seem to think it does. Link me to PROOF.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 27, 2013, 04:05 pm
Could you provide more details? Were you on/ever been on SSRIs?
I've never been on an SSRI/SNRI/Tricyclic Antidepressant in my entire lifetime.

You're hopeless.  I knew you were an NBOMbe vendor.  I'm done talking to you.
You should take a page from Tyl3rdurden's book.  But obviously you lack both the comprehension and understanding to do so.
Enjoy selling your poisons, and I hope you sleep great at night.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 27, 2013, 04:21 pm
Now, could you get back to providing some real evidence? I've been there when several people have taken it, gotten feedback from everyone who I gave it too (I've sold 350 so there's 350 people without a bad experience). But again, completely anecdotal and means NOTHING. You seem to think it does. Link me to PROOF.
We humans are funny creatures. If you weren't selling this shit you would probably have a different opinion on it. But it seems like you need to keep reassuring yourself that you aren't doing anything wrong here.
(not saying you are, just saying you seem like you need to keep reinstating it to prove something)

I think your link to proof will come when you or friends of yours become scarred as a result of taking them.

I'm telling you man everyone I know that has had nbomes comes out affected in some way, shape, or form, to the point that it is noticeable....

I mean, do whatever you want. this is not us telling you how to live your life, we are just giving you our personal opinions.


I feel like people only sell these shitty things because they are cheap as fuck. I know that if you could get lsd and sell it for the same price you sure as fuck would, maybe even pay double the price and you still would.  real psychedelics provide a connection to something magestic/divine in a sense. that's why I was saying I don't think these should be sold to psychedelic noobs, as they are cheap, dirty, and the experience is far from a true psychedelic experience IMO.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: khorne flake on August 27, 2013, 04:46 pm
Nbomes are garbage, like seriously if you were to hand me a kilo of straight 25i-nbome and run off I would cover it with gas and set it on fire.

I think anybody who involves themselves in the nbome trade is a scumbag.  There is no denying that people are taking your products being sold it as LSD.

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 27, 2013, 10:07 pm
Now, could you get back to providing some real evidence? I've been there when several people have taken it, gotten feedback from everyone who I gave it too (I've sold 350 so there's 350 people without a bad experience). But again, completely anecdotal and means NOTHING. You seem to think it does. Link me to PROOF.
We humans are funny creatures. If you weren't selling this shit you would probably have a different opinion on it. But it seems like you need to keep reassuring yourself that you aren't doing anything wrong here.
(not saying you are, just saying you seem like you need to keep reinstating it to prove something)

I think your link to proof will come when you or friends of yours become scarred as a result of taking them.

I'm telling you man everyone I know that has had nbomes comes out affected in some way, shape, or form, to the point that it is noticeable....

I mean, do whatever you want. this is not us telling you how to live your life, we are just giving you our personal opinions.


I feel like people only sell these shitty things because they are cheap as fuck. I know that if you could get lsd and sell it for the same price you sure as fuck would, maybe even pay double the price and you still would.  real psychedelics provide a connection to something magestic/divine in a sense. that's why I was saying I don't think these should be sold to psychedelic noobs, as they are cheap, dirty, and the experience is far from a true psychedelic experience IMO.

I have been vending acid for years. I offer everyone 'real' LSD (pretty much none of the LSD in the EU is actually LSD - this is straight from the chemists mouth

I was hoping for an intelligent discussion on this board but I guess it's just not up to that standard yet. I think I'll try the advanced drug discussion thread on bluelight - as there is either no evidence or you don't know of any (otherwise you would've posted it)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 27, 2013, 10:12 pm
Could you provide more details? Were you on/ever been on SSRIs?
I've never been on an SSRI/SNRI/Tricyclic Antidepressant in my entire lifetime.

You're hopeless.  I knew you were an NBOMbe vendor.  I'm done talking to you.
You should take a page from Tyl3rdurden's book.  But obviously you lack both the comprehension and understanding to do so.
Enjoy selling your poisons, and I hope you sleep great at night.

I'm going to try and salvage this as you're just resulting to petty insults

Since it wasn't SSRIs - what do you think the reasoning is? I only got back in the scene a few months ago - nbombs have been popular since 2010 and if it was as toxic as people seem to think there would be a lot more evidence considering there have certainly been at least 1mil tabs consumed (complete guess on how popular it is on Silk Road)

When mephedrone came out. The reasons that made it dangerous came out very quickly. Why hasn't this happened for NBOMe?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 27, 2013, 10:48 pm
I was hoping for an intelligent discussion on this board but I guess it's just not up to that standard yet. I think I'll try the advanced drug discussion thread on bluelight - as there is either no evidence or you don't know of any (otherwise you would've posted it)
Enjoy your intelligent discussion over there.

meanwhile, check out this quote from one of Sr's most popular nbome vendors!
Quote
Whether we admit it or not, today NBOMe's are causing harm to people
At first the reports of negative effects coming back were from unknown contributors but there are a growing number of respected board members denouncing this substance, both here and on Bluelight.

::)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: shizzlefitz on August 28, 2013, 12:17 am
I'm jumping into this thread late but I'll give my opinion as someone who's tried nbomes and has something to compare it to.

Fact is deep down I do think it's more dangerous than acid but that has everything to do with dosage. The difference is that you can go way overboard with LSD and still not risk a medical emergency and that's obviously not the case with the n-bombs which is made worse by the fact that they're cheap. Even worse than that they're often sold as powder which only invites disaster. How the hell does the average joe measure 1mg of powder?

However as long as you're responsible enough to hold yourself at the 2 or maybe even 3 blotter tab mark and not do it all the time I would agree that this chem is reasonably safe, fun and an acceptable alternative to LSD. I know that's a lot of ifs but I'm pretty sure most can handle it. And LSD isn't "magical" or "divine". It's a semi-synthetic chemical that acts on neuroreceptors. Just like the 2c family does.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: GGGreenbud on August 28, 2013, 12:47 am

    I did some research recently into psychedelics and SSRIs after a friend of mine had a bad reaction to one of the newer ergoloids on 40mg citalopram(the highest dosage allowed by law) which he has been fed some bullshit science about being only active if the non-enteric pills are not crushed.  SSRIs and NBOMe act primarily upon 5HT2 receptors, so much so, that the 5HT1 receptor complex becomes "desensitized" now, you might think this is a good thing, 5HT1 is associated with nausea and migraines, right? desensitization isn't bad, right?  its just tolerance, right?
WRONG.
Desensitization, I believe, is a side effect of BOTH of these drugs, leading to adverse reactions of an unpredictable type.   Desensitization, leads to a downregulation, lets visualize this as a balanced lever, the more desensitization, the larger the fulcrum becomes, the less force is necessary to push the lever down.
  Eventually, the lever becomes so unstable that the result becomes completely unpredictable.  This is why it is dangerous to sell any psychedelic, that is why most of us are here, we don't want some 20yo kid telling us we sold him "bad acid" and getting robbed/beatdown by his friends, because his zoloft didn't agree with the acid he was taking.  The younger generation these days see themselves as the 'hero' generation, and that every problem can be overcome.  We have lived too long to know this is not the case.   I don't care if people do NBOMe, I just am continually surprised that NO ONE I've talked to even knows what it is, outside of SR.   I could be wrong about some of the ideas in this post, I'm not saying SSRIs are the problem, I'm saying that they could be the key to understanding why NBOMe has the dangers that it does.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: GGGreenbud on August 28, 2013, 01:55 am

I have been vending acid for years. I offer everyone 'real' LSD (pretty much none of the LSD in the EU is actually LSD - this is straight from the chemists mouth

I was hoping for an intelligent discussion on this board but I guess it's just not up to that standard yet. I think I'll try the advanced drug discussion thread on bluelight - as there is either no evidence or you don't know of any (otherwise you would've posted it)

   So what is the LSx going around now?
I'd really like to know, it sounds fascinating, please tell.
  As far as I know, only the one batch of hoffmans has ever been verified to be anything other than LSD.  Of course, with crystal AL-LAD going around, we could debate this, as it is sufficiently close, but I would really like to know what people are selling if it isn't LSD.   Don't you think the word would have gotten out by now?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 28, 2013, 10:54 am

I have been vending acid for years. I offer everyone 'real' LSD (pretty much none of the LSD in the EU is actually LSD - this is straight from the chemists mouth

I was hoping for an intelligent discussion on this board but I guess it's just not up to that standard yet. I think I'll try the advanced drug discussion thread on bluelight - as there is either no evidence or you don't know of any (otherwise you would've posted it)

   So what is the LSx going around now?
I'd really like to know, it sounds fascinating, please tell.
  As far as I know, only the one batch of hoffmans has ever been verified to be anything other than LSD.  Of course, with crystal AL-LAD going around, we could debate this, as it is sufficiently close, but I would really like to know what people are selling if it isn't LSD.   Don't you think the word would have gotten out by now?

Not really, I was selling them for years. Probably sold in excess of 100-200k (I ran a vendor called 'Lucigenol' back in 08). I didn't find out til years after - People RAVED about these things, said it was the cleanest acid they've had. (It was sold as 220ugs). It wasn't until years after the middle-man between me and the chemist was like "Uh yeah, turns out that wasn't actually LSD it was x". I've forgotton the name because it's so obscure. It has like 1 paragraph of text on wikipedia.

These chemists do it for a living, there is even a chemical that metabolises into LSD-25 inside you, so up until you injest it. It's a legal chemical.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 28, 2013, 11:11 am
Nbomes are garbage, like seriously if you were to hand me a kilo of straight 25i-nbome and run off I would cover it with gas and set it on fire.

I think anybody who involves themselves in the nbome trade is a scumbag.  There is no denying that people are taking your products being sold it as LSD.

Except its kinda hugely noticeably different. The taste is a big giveaway.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 28, 2013, 02:24 pm
And LSD isn't "magical" or "divine". It's a semi-synthetic chemical that acts on neuroreceptors. Just like the 2c family does.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0k1So0zwuws

skip to 12:30 in that video to find the reason as to why tryptamines and lsd have a "magical" aspect, and the pheneths fall behind in that category.

I know he goes more in-depth as to why the 5ht1a receptor causes more "mystical" experiences.

There is my "science" so let me just say this.

You really think the 2c-x drugs are as magical as lsd? lol have you ever taken real lsd?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: GGGreenbud on August 28, 2013, 02:43 pm

I have been vending acid for years. I offer everyone 'real' LSD (pretty much none of the LSD in the EU is actually LSD - this is straight from the chemists mouth



Not really, I was selling them for years. Probably sold in excess of 100-200k (I ran a vendor called 'Lucigenol' back in 08). I didn't find out til years after - People RAVED about these things, said it was the cleanest acid they've had. (It was sold as 220ugs). It wasn't until years after the middle-man between me and the chemist was like "Uh yeah, turns out that wasn't actually LSD it was x". I've forgotton the name because it's so obscure. It has like 1 paragraph of text on wikipedia.

These chemists do it for a living, there is even a chemical that metabolises into LSD-25 inside you, so up until you injest it. It's a legal chemical.
Not trying to be an asshole, but if you sold me ALD-52 as LSD, I'd tell you to slap my ass and call me sally!
 
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 28, 2013, 02:50 pm
Not trying to be an asshole, but if you sold me ALD-52 as LSD, I'd tell you to slap my ass and call me sally!

lol yeah, I would definitely be okay with ald-52 being sold to me as lsd.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: khorne flake on August 28, 2013, 04:15 pm
Nbomes are garbage, like seriously if you were to hand me a kilo of straight 25i-nbome and run off I would cover it with gas and set it on fire.

I think anybody who involves themselves in the nbome trade is a scumbag.  There is no denying that people are taking your products being sold it as LSD.

Except its kinda hugely noticeably different. The taste is a big giveaway.

No shit.  I'm not talking about NBOMe's fooling experienced LSD users, I'm talking about high schoolers and college kids who want to try LSD for their first time and get sold this sham which could arguably ruin "the magic" of one's first trip on LSD.  I'm talking about a whole generation of kids who think it's called acid because it tastes like fucking battery acid.

Hope the money is worth it you greedy pig.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 28, 2013, 08:03 pm
I'm talking about a whole generation of kids who think it's called acid because it tastes like fucking battery acid.

This is so fucking quotable!
Dem Khorne Flakes don't lie!
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on August 28, 2013, 11:01 pm
Nbomes are garbage, like seriously if you were to hand me a kilo of straight 25i-nbome and run off I would cover it with gas and set it on fire.

I think anybody who involves themselves in the nbome trade is a scumbag.  There is no denying that people are taking your products being sold it as LSD.

Except its kinda hugely noticeably different. The taste is a big giveaway.

No shit.  I'm not talking about NBOMe's fooling experienced LSD users, I'm talking about high schoolers and college kids who want to try LSD for their first time and get sold this sham which could arguably ruin "the magic" of one's first trip on LSD.  I'm talking about a whole generation of kids who think it's called acid because it tastes like fucking battery acid.

Hope the money is worth it you greedy pig.

I sell mine as NBOMes, tell them its similar but more visual and less introspective and tell them to google it. I was actually looking into putting QR codes onto each tab which would link to a basic guide.

Bitter tabs is a big giveaway for adulterants, I knew that when I was 15. It's common sense to look into harm-reduction. I can't do more than that so maybe you should start preaching harm-REDUCTION instead of shouting abstinence! in the corner.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: shizzlefitz on August 29, 2013, 08:57 am
And LSD isn't "magical" or "divine". It's a semi-synthetic chemical that acts on neuroreceptors. Just like the 2c family does.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0k1So0zwuws

skip to 12:30 in that video to find the reason as to why tryptamines and lsd have a "magical" aspect, and the pheneths fall behind in that category.

I know he goes more in-depth as to why the 5ht1a receptor causes more "mystical" experiences.

There is my "science" so let me just say this.

You really think the 2c-x drugs are as magical as lsd? lol have you ever taken real lsd?

Dude, your experiences may be mystical and all but realize that it's all happening in your head. People see Jesus on toast bread or dog vomit and start praying FFS. So what. Acid isn't some magical gift from the gods. It's a frikkin chemical that has a certain reaction in your body which YOU interpret as supernatural. A lot of people, me included, could go on an acid trip and report a life-changing experience. It happens with DMT or falling in love or eating a bad burrito and it can certainly happen with nbomes too.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: jhancock1984 on August 29, 2013, 03:03 pm
And LSD isn't "magical" or "divine". It's a semi-synthetic chemical that acts on neuroreceptors. Just like the 2c family does.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0k1So0zwuws

skip to 12:30 in that video to find the reason as to why tryptamines and lsd have a "magical" aspect, and the pheneths fall behind in that category.

I know he goes more in-depth as to why the 5ht1a receptor causes more "mystical" experiences.

There is my "science" so let me just say this.

You really think the 2c-x drugs are as magical as lsd? lol have you ever taken real lsd?

Dude, your experiences may be mystical and all but realize that it's all happening in your head. People see Jesus on toast bread or dog vomit and start praying FFS. So what. Acid isn't some magical gift from the gods. It's a frikkin chemical that has a certain reaction in your body which YOU interpret as supernatural. A lot of people, me included, could go on an acid trip and report a life-changing experience. It happens with DMT or falling in love or eating a bad burrito and it can certainly happen with nbomes too.

Ahh the mystical/spiritual experience debate.

To toss my two cents in.  Over the last year I've eaten a lot of psychedelics thanks to discovering SR.  I've had my share of mystical experiences and I've also had my share of mundane experiences.  What I've come to understand is that life has no inherent meaning and it only has the meaning we give to it.  That religion and my quest for God, the meaning of life, etc. etc. was a security blanket I was using because I was afraid to live my life and make my own decisions.  I wanted big sky Daddy up there telling me that everything was okay, that I was loved and special and all of that shit.  In the end though I realized that it's up to me to love and accept myself.  I learned this on oral DMT.

In the end it's not about the drugs, it's about your mindset.

And personally speaking, 25c was a major part of all of that.  It may not have the 'magic' of LSD, DMT, and Mushrooms.  But what it does have is a certain honesty about the universe.  When I wasn't willing to give meaning to my own life 25c was some scary shit because it didn't feed that receptor in my brain that so easily buys into magical thinking.  It was hollow because my life was hollow, because I wanted someone 'else' to give my life meaning.   Now my 25c experiences are anything but hollow.  They're full, they're beautiful, they're humbling.  Possibly as 'spiritual' as DMT if you want to call it that.  Certainly full of love.

As far as safety is concerned though I do have to agree that they're not as safe as other psychedelics.  People think they're as safe as LSD and don't give them due respect.  It's sad but they're certainly not the only drugs that are potentially fatal.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 29, 2013, 04:55 pm
Dude, your experiences may be mystical and all but realize that it's all happening in your head.

Everything happens in our heads. Everything you see right now is a signal that your brain took in, made sense of, and projected back to you in a form YOU can understand.

And it goes deeper than that really, because our perceptions build the world around us anyways.
We see what our brains are used to seeing, and a lot of information gets tuned out.
We are all in our own little worlds, so to speak.

Also, they have recently done studies on psilocybin and brain functioning.

they found that psilocybin slows down brain activity in certain parts of the brain, and those parts are theorized to be responsible for our filtering mechanisms, which causes more information to make its way in, and also causes senses to become meshed.

So basically with that concept psychedelics are helping us see the unseen, take in signals in different ways, and take in more information in general.

Why do you take psychedelics if you think the entire experience is fake?


And one more question. Have you ever taken heroic doses of psilocybin mushrooms? Just wondering ::)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: LeadSingersDisease on August 29, 2013, 07:32 pm
Didn't tyler (I think) put 25i/b on his tabs to stop people selling them as LSD? I think this is a good idea because:

People are dicks and sell it off as LSD because it's easier
Kid wants to try LSD does no research but his friend has told him you cant die from it
Kid ups his dose and decides to be cool and do a thumbprint type dose
Death

Far-fetched I know. I have no problem with nbomes (don't particularly like them though, find them lacking) but it pisses me off when people don't inform the users of what they are putting into their bodies (or outright lying). This is when it becomes dangerous. At the end of the day we know 90% of drug users do not do any research and go by word of mouth and these drugs don't have a safe history so if you sell them you should do your best to make sure that whoever receives them doesn't try and pass it off as LSD. I know this shouldn't be the vendors responsibility but in reality if the vendor doesn't make it his then the street dealer definitely isn't.

BTW - Tyler you where a fantastic vendor and your decision is totally understandable. You where making a killing and decided that you couldn't continue because you knew the inevitable...

These drugs are still going to hit the market so if the government isn't going to regulate them maybe the vendors should lead by example but by the same token I wonder how much of any 25x's sales would drop if they where labeled?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: shizzlefitz on August 29, 2013, 10:33 pm
Dude, your experiences may be mystical and all but realize that it's all happening in your head.

Everything happens in our heads. Everything you see right now is a signal that your brain took in, made sense of, and projected back to you in a form YOU can understand.

And it goes deeper than that really, because our perceptions build the world around us anyways.
We see what our brains are used to seeing, and a lot of information gets tuned out.
We are all in our own little worlds, so to speak.

In psychology this field of study is known as solipsism and it's not what I was angling at (though it's an interesting subject well worthy of pondering, especially while on acid!). What I meant was that qualitatively, in the acid vs 25i-nbome experience, it's bullshit to say that the acid trip is magical or whatever other adjective and that the nbome is crap. There is no fundamental difference between the two. They each act in our brains in different ways. Acid, yes, does so with a lot more subtlety and is unquestionably less risky but in the end if we evaluate the effects objectively we can't say that one produces a more or less mystical experience than the other <-- this is my point.

Quote

Why do you take psychedelics if you think the entire experience is fake?

And one more question. Have you ever taken heroic doses of psilocybin mushrooms? Just wondering ::)

Why? Because I enjoy it. I don't think the experience is fake even if the hallucinations are. I very much enjoy the visuals and the good time I have. I'm not a hippie looking for healing or higher truth or any of that mumbo jumbo. I'm just a guy looking for a good time and find it, additionally, endlessly fascinating how the brain can make up such mathematically inspired imagery independent of my consciousness in the CEVs. That's all.

No, I've never done mushrooms at all and very likely never will (Vanquish's experience scared the bejeezus out of me). I did, however, swish down with OJ ~40mg of 4-ACO-DMT and all I had to show for the experience was a funky feeling in my throat, a weird sort of mindfuck and very minimal visual warping plus the inability to fall asleep for several hours afterwards. What am I missing?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: khorne flake on August 30, 2013, 03:32 am
nbomes never gave me any sort of insight about life or the world, the only insight they gave me was how shitty they make me feel, and how important it is for me to keep real acid alive and strong and available to those that are willing to pay the ticket and take the ride.

you are the first person I've seen to report a meaningful experience with an nbome.

Mushrooms are fucking awesome, and if you are into tripping on nbomes you can definitely handle the body load that can accompany mushrooms.  I have to say, learn from vanquish's experience, start slow.  Mushrooms can be so incredibly overwhelming if you are not ready for them.  Start with half a gram, maybe even a quarter of a gram and work your way up from there.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on August 30, 2013, 11:00 am
No, I've never done mushrooms at all and very likely never will (Vanquish's experience scared the bejeezus out of me). I did, however, swish down with OJ ~40mg of 4-ACO-DMT and all I had to show for the experience was a funky feeling in my throat, a weird sort of mindfuck and very minimal visual warping plus the inability to fall asleep for several hours afterwards. What am I missing?

Just a personal opinion, but stick with LSD.  Much cleaner, no body load, deeper insight.  All around a superior psychedelic.  Also buy some AL-LAD according to Shulgin it's one of the best psychedelics ever.
Buy some and stock up before it's gone.  I'd say buy as much as possible once you try it and see how it affects you.

Check my Public Apology Thread out as well, and if you do decide to try Mushrooms. 
Make sure you are in very good health. 
They take a heavy toll on the body for something so benign.
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=208653.0

If you do decide to try them, buy them from Shaggy in order to show support to both myself, him, and the Silk Road community.

Thank you,
Vanquish

*Another pointless and redundant warning STAY AWAY FROM NBOMe's**  :)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: jhancock1984 on August 30, 2013, 03:03 pm
I love LSD as much as the next guy but the 'no body load' idea if the acid is 'clean' is a myth.  Psychedelics effect everyone in different ways and personally LSD gives me a mild body load but I had a friend that couldn't trip without getting terrible cramps.

25c gave me severe vasoconstriction up until recently.  I don't know what changed, maybe my diet, maybe the fact that I've been exercising more, maybe that I quit smoking.  But the last time I took it it was one of the cleanest feeling trips I've ever had.

Point being, everyone's mileage is going to vary as far as body load goes.

As to LSD giving deeper insight, I guess this really depends on what you're after.  Mushrooms and DMT both have their own insight to offer as they bind to different receptors in your brain then LSD does.  There's really no best psychedelic just like there's no best kind of food or best kind of wine.  There's just different tastes for different folks.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 30, 2013, 03:09 pm
I did, however, swish down with OJ ~40mg of 4-ACO-DMT and all I had to show for the experience was a funky feeling in my throat, a weird sort of mindfuck and very minimal visual warping plus the inability to fall asleep for several hours afterwards. What am I missing?

I would just say wait about one month to do any psychedelic, then repeat that 40 mg dose with no tolerance.

That should be an epic experience for sure...... Like balls to the wall haha.

I definitely think that was the nbome tolerance.  Who did you get 4-aco from?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: shizzlefitz on August 30, 2013, 08:12 pm
Yeah, wavelength, I do have to agree with you that my experience with 4-ACo-DMT, bought here on SR from the guy who sells it in pill form, needs to be repeated because it came just two weeks after getting blitzed on 2mg of 25i-Nbome. For me the body load on the nbomes is moderate at that dosage (and I'm in my mid forties and out of shape which should be saying something) but the thing that I don't like is that cross tolerance to anything stronger than a milkshake. Two weeks should have been enough to reset my tolerance but I'm guessing not.

Still have 7 tabs of Al-LADooh akbar left :-)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: SeekEnlighten on August 30, 2013, 08:21 pm
Can someone please explain to me the difference between 25c and 25i? Is it noticable?
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: wavelength on August 30, 2013, 09:57 pm
Can someone please explain to me the difference between 25c and 25i? Is it noticable?

25c is much more subtle. I didn't get any vasoconstriction from it and it has the least stimulation out of the nbomes I've tried.

visuals tend to have geometric grids engrained into them (for me), and they tend to be quite lsd like.

Very minimal mindspace. You are quite able to ignore any dark thought or vibe with this one.

25i is a little bit more stimulative and wirey. visuals tend to be a bit more drastic and in your face, but I found them less interesting then the patterning of 25c

I've gotten into a few mind fucky trips with 25i, yet there is still an emotionally neutral aspect to it in a sense, yet not as ignorable as 25c.

Yes, the differences are definitely noticeable.

I personally found 25b the most interesting. It showed me some extremely bazaar things in vivid detail, and while the body load is worse than 25c it's less intense than i.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: SeekEnlighten on August 30, 2013, 10:00 pm
Can someone please explain to me the difference between 25c and 25i? Is it noticable?

25c is much more subtle. I didn't get any vasoconstriction from it and it has the least stimulation out of the nbomes I've tried.

visuals tend to have geometric grids engrained into them (for me), and they tend to be quite lsd like.

Very minimal mindspace. You are quite able to ignore any dark thought or vibe with this one.

25i is a little bit more stimulative and wirey. visuals tend to be a bit more drastic and in your face, but I found them less interesting then the patterning of 25c

I've gotten into a few mind fucky trips with 25i, yet there is still an emotionally neutral aspect to it in a sense, yet not as ignorable as 25c.

Yes, the differences are definitely noticeable.

I personally found 25b the most interesting. It showed me some extremely bazaar things in vivid detail, and while the body load is worse than 25c it's less intense than i.

Wow, thank you SO MUCH dude. I've been asking around and no one really gave me a legit answer until now. Thank you sir. I tried 25i, it was cool but felt really speedy. Hopefuklly 25c is a bit more mellow.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: CiscoYankerStuck on August 31, 2013, 02:07 am
I'd like to provide a counter opinion to all the NBOMe hate.

While yes, they have much more of a body load than LSD, and are progressively less safe in larger doses, telling people to avoid NBOMe's at all costs seems a bit close-minded, especially for a place like these forums.

They can be a fantastic experience (even spiritual or deep or profound too). If someone is interested in them, they should do the proper research and decide if it's right for them, as a responsible drug user would with any drug. And maybe start out with very small doses and work up from there, just to be safe.


@shizzlefitz

Try some mushrooms; you are indeed missing out on something. :)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: khorne flake on August 31, 2013, 10:53 pm
You are hearing that from people experienced with many psychedelics, if you don't want to heed that advice, that's your decision.

There is a reason why people will pay $25+ dollars a hit for some bomb LSD, yet NBOMes are only 50 cents.

Find out for yourself, it's your life. Your trip.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on September 01, 2013, 04:18 pm
This has just became a pissing match between the effects. We're trying to spread harm-reduction here and see wtf is going on.

I've created and ADD thread on bluelight please constribute if you have even anecdotal stories of unusual effects on regular doses like people in this thread.

**clearnet**
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/688849-25i-NBOMe-(nbombs)-possible-dangers

Would be great if tyl3rdurden could make a post as he obviously has a lot of experience here

Ta
(I will be ditching all psuedonames, moving to another country and starting fresh in a few weeks so don't worry about me linking psuedonames)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: HeatFireFlame on September 01, 2013, 05:40 pm
This has just became a pissing match between the effects. We're trying to spread harm-reduction here and see wtf is going on.

I've created and ADD thread on bluelight please constribute if you have even anecdotal stories of unusual effects on regular doses like people in this thread.

**clearnet**
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/688849-25i-NBOMe-(nbombs)-possible-dangers

Would be great if tyl3rdurden could make a post as he obviously has a lot of experience here

Ta
(I will be ditching all psuedonames, moving to another country and starting fresh in a few weeks so don't worry about me linking psuedonames)

Authraix. There are people all over this thread telling you the negative effects of Nbome and you are refusing to take their answers seriously, I have no idea why. If your looking for direct scientific evidence then it will be harder to find, But the fact you are not taking anyone seriously in this thread is annoying.
As i said previously I have seen the thread between you and an lsd vendor where he was telling you about tyl3r's comments, and provied links, And told you that tyl3r had easily sold over 10,000 tabs and you were dismissing it and saying that 10,000 is a very small amount and that you personally had sold hundreds of thousands.

I will add this was in a thread started by you, Where you were asking if a vendor sending you Nbome in a letter with the tabs in the open wrapped in a couple of bits of notepad paper was safe stealth.
As SW said, If you were selling hundreds of thousand of tabs, Even hundreds you would know this was not acceptable.

Just take what people are telling you and accept it, You get what you pay for and thats that.
LSD is clearly better/safer than nbome.

Hff
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on September 01, 2013, 08:04 pm
This has just became a pissing match between the effects. We're trying to spread harm-reduction here and see wtf is going on.

I've created and ADD thread on bluelight please constribute if you have even anecdotal stories of unusual effects on regular doses like people in this thread.

**clearnet**
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/688849-25i-NBOMe-(nbombs)-possible-dangers

Would be great if tyl3rdurden could make a post as he obviously has a lot of experience here

Ta
(I will be ditching all psuedonames, moving to another country and starting fresh in a few weeks so don't worry about me linking psuedonames)

Authraix. There are people all over this thread telling you the negative effects of Nbome and you are refusing to take their answers seriously, I have no idea why. If your looking for direct scientific evidence then it will be harder to find, But the fact you are not taking anyone seriously in this thread is annoying.
As i said previously I have seen the thread between you and an lsd vendor where he was telling you about tyl3r's comments, and provied links, And told you that tyl3r had easily sold over 10,000 tabs and you were dismissing it and saying that 10,000 is a very small amount and that you personally had sold hundreds of thousands.

I will add this was in a thread started by you, Where you were asking if a vendor sending you Nbome in a letter with the tabs in the open wrapped in a couple of bits of notepad paper was safe stealth.
As SW said, If you were selling hundreds of thousand of tabs, Even hundreds you would know this was not acceptable.

Just take what people are telling you and accept it, You get what you pay for and thats that.
LSD is clearly better/safer than nbome.

Hff

Actually NBOMe is a much more stable chemical than LSD so it's fine to transport this way. My cousin jumped in the pool with his and they still worked fine.

Further more, there are a handful of people claiming negative physical effects. The only one i was taking seriously was Vanquish's but he's in detox not and in not so sure NBOMEe was the problem in his life.

I'm asking people to go and post well written reports with dosage, interactions, drug history, etc. SPREADING HARM REDUCTION instead of the nonsense in this thread. Go read the thread in off topic I've posted in if you don't believe I've been doing this for the best part of a decade.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: marcellus_wallace on September 02, 2013, 12:44 am
I recently did about 600ug of 25i and had a great time. Enhanced all my day's activities especially taking a walk outdoors. I highly recommend that if you're interested in nbome to try atleast a small sample and work your way up.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on September 02, 2013, 02:17 am
You are hearing that from people experienced with many psychedelics, if you don't want to heed that advice, that's your decision.

There is a reason why people will pay $25+ dollars a hit for some bomb LSD, yet NBOMes are only 50 cents.

Find out for yourself, it's your life. Your trip.

Amen brother, that's exactly what I would have said myself - keep this dirty nasty shit far away from your bodies.
I still haven't been "right" ever since my 25I-NBOMe episode.  It definitely really fucks with your serotonin receptors.
There has to be some weird very concerning chemical changes in regard to what happened to me neurological pathways/
I can still trip, but my tolerance is strange at the moment.  I'm wondering if somehow it leads to long term damage to the receptors similar to MDMA if you don't post/preload.
The tension headaches, seizures, thought loops, and audio distortions - are not my sense of an ideal trip.

I do believe that my receptors have returned to some sense of normalcy since then. 
But I really fucked up and should have instantly reached for melatonin and 5-HTP after this happened.
Seriously these things hit your serotonin receptors in the worst possible way.
It's alarming, for sure.  I honestly think age has the biggest factor here.  At least when you are young you can still heal quickly and usually make full and healthy recovery. 
When I was younger I could no doubt push my body to extreme heroic dosages of substances and come out perfectly fine.

Now that I'm older and my brain chemistry has changed, because of the constant abuse to all of my receptors due to recklessness and the all to well "I'm invincible syndrome".
MDA benders, lack of knowledge in general and the fact that lots of the information out there now wasn't available then.

I'm not entirely sure what it does to your brain exactly, but from the way it fries your head like an egg. 
I highly doubt anything good could possibly come of it.
On the flip side...
LSD is meant to cleanse the mind, body, and soul.
Repair your neural pathways, and stimulate your brain into it's own mind's eye and to look outwards at what has been trapped inside.

TLDR - Don't go cheap and risk your life messing with NBOMe's they are honestly the most concerning chemicals around right now.
           I'm sure people at Bluelight ADD and stuff will look further and continue to study these molecules.
           But personally, it's not worth it.
           Buy some LSD, try some AL-LAD, hell even MXE is highly psychedelic once you get used to the confusion and dissociation.
           I'd say my MXE trip the other night was eerily similar to 100ug's of good acid, and eerily similar in the patterning, melding, warping, and distorting of objects.
           Plus it has an extremely similar head space to LSD with deep introspection and some of the best focus and pain relieving qualities that I've seen out of any substance.

           Final closing thoughts and conclusions.
               
           Seriously, with the amount of good LSD on Silk Road right now do your self the self justice and pick some up.
           We are literally FLOODED with AMAZING delicious acid right now.
           Damn lucky to have such amazing vendors keeping us going with this constant stream of it right now.
           I could seriously recommend about 15 vendors right now with my highest stamp of recommendation.

           If you are worried about the time constraints of LSD for some reason and don't have the full 12+ hours to chill and come down.
           Then consider looking into AL-LAD, MDA, or the other host of other options that you have at your disposal.
           All of these vendors deserve your money, for providing us with this beautiful molecule.
           Show them the karma and respect that they vastly deserve.  Seriously we are blessed at this day in age.
           LSD continues to be at the forefront and golden standard it always has and it always will be
           As for what I believe will never be surpassed no matter how hard they keep trying to outskirt the law.
           
           It's vitally important that you read up on anything and everything you can.  Just because you are young doesn't mean you should binge and damage your body and mind.
           Such vast information on almost all aspects of quality of life improvements, and harm reduction has increased drastically since the early 2000's.
           Thanks in part to Silk Road, Bluelight, and Erowid.
           Consider yourself blessed if you just turned 18 and you are growing up during one of the most revolutionary times of our world all thanks to Silk Road.
           It's a very critical and pivotal moment in the scheme of things, as advances in technology, medicine, and drug research and advancement continue to grow.

           NBOMe's are mainly used for profiteers and sold without regards to their customers well being or safety.
           In that regard, I don't support it even for that fact alone.  Selling anything as LSD to anyone who may be unfamiliar with the obvious and vast difference.
           Can instantly lead to big trouble, very quickly.  Especially if they are used to street quality and low dosed blotters.
           The blotters are often very unevenly laid, and you can see some tabs advertised as 1000ug's and you can hit a patch of blotter that is drenched in way over that amount.
           I think you can begin to see the problem here.  I had bought 100 25I-NBOMe tab's and you know what I took those mother fuckers and threw them into my barbeque pit.
           Hell I never even asked the vendor for some type of reimbursement for the entire ordeal.  Because I'd prefer to stay away from anything remotely associated with NBOMe's.
     
           **No matter how careful or experienced you are even the most experienced tripper can experience very troubling toxicity and permanent damage to your mind and body.**

           These are highly volatile, unpredictable, and dirty feeling chemicals.  You are obviously free to ingest what ever the fuck you want.  But you have been warned.
           
           Be safe use LSD should be the slogan for anyone who takes their brain, heart, kidneys, and overall well-being seriously.

            :)

            <3 Vanquish
           
       

       
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: jhancock1984 on September 04, 2013, 10:14 pm
You miss the point.

Every psychedelic effects your brain differently and offers different experiences.  It's not that LSD == Better it's that LSD just isn't 25c or 25i.

You're also comparing apples to oranges.  25i is a full agonist.  25c is not.  I tried both and won't touch 25i because the down regulation it caused even at low doses I found very scary (I couldn't make out glossy surfaces for two weeks).  25c on the other hand offers me a different experience then LSD.  Do I love LSD?  Yes I do.  Do I know it's safer than 25c?  Yes I do.  Do I believe they both have a place in my medicine cabinet regardless of cost?  Yes I do.

Now if the main point of this thread is safety and education that's great.  But quite honestly, you...  especially you Vanquish, come off like one of those DARE propaganda spreaders I had to deal with in Middle and High School.  It sucks that you feel 25i may have damaged your receptors and maybe it did.  But you also mention the abuse of MDA and MDMA and how reckless you've been with your drug use.  And then you go on to attribute properties to LSD that it simply doesn't have.  You're not being scientific.  You're up on your soap box spewing anecdotes like a preacher and frankly, that's a bitter pill for anyone to swallow.

If you really want to do some good, say your piece and move on.  Otherwise I'm going to assume that you're just feeding your ego.

FWIW people attributed all sorts of bizarre negative effects to LSD back in the day too.  Nearly all of them were unfounded.

*edit*  I also find it ridiculous that you go on to recommend MDA, a chemical that is clearly neuro-toxic, for people that don't have time for a full LSD trip.  It's almost like you have no fucking idea what you're talking about...
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: T5 on September 04, 2013, 10:16 pm
Just take what people are telling you and accept it, You get what you pay for and thats that.
LSD is clearly better/safer than nbome.

Hmm
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Tyl3rdurden on September 07, 2013, 01:57 pm
Closing up shop was not a decision we took lightly.
The money from vending was my only source of income, my life in fact.
We were at one point arguably the largest vendor on here (top 1%, 100% positive feedback) This should give you an idea of the volume we produced and the income we gave up. I estimate we distributed over 1,000,000 of these things.

There were two main issues which influenced my decision to stop.

1. It seems that different people have different reactions to this chemical. The odds that you will be the one who reacts badly are tiny, but a party is no longer a party if one person seizes out and dies.

Respected psychedelic users from various forums, notably Bluelight, of which I am a member, the shroomery, and other boards have all expressed their concern over this chemical.
I believe I am a logical person. I believe I think rationally. I know that many reported cases will involve abnormal factors such as high doses, irresponsible use, polydrug use, etc etc.
There are reports of this drug causing seizures and deaths (A few months back, one of our customers sent us a message to say he had experienced a seizure on one tab - no other drugs involved. We brushing it aside and moved along, figuring there must have been some other reason). A moderator on Bluelight took a normal dose of 25-c and performed regular blood pressure checks throughout (dangerously high). This was someone with a highly respected experience and understanding of tryps/phens and a decent understanding of neurochemistry and biology. They stated they wouldn't take it again. I have used the chemical multiple times and never had a bad experience, but I cannot divert my attention from the reports of seizures and deaths that are coming in, and equally importantly, the opinions of highly experienced psychonauts who know their own minds and bodies better than many can ever possibly imagine.


2. The second reason I decided to pull away from this is because of first hand experience of the attitudes of the younger generation towards drugs.
It can't be helped, this is just how they are. I gave a strip of 25i to a kid I am still friends with, who I met at a festival. A couple of weeks later he told me, laughing, 'I sold that research chemical stuff off to someone - just told them it was acid!'. I shook my head and just felt sad (yes I did try and explain why this was wrong but it seemed to go over his head)

This is the problem we face. It doesn't matter if I can convince myself, logically, that each and every user should be responsible for identifying the chemical they are about to ingest, and understand the safety aspects of it and the correct dosage, we at the top are feeding a system where we must expect this sort of thing to happen. Many will disagree with me here - and I fully understand, I was of the former school of thought this time last year.

If a chemical becomes something I would not want to share with a loved one, I would no longer wish to share it with the rest of the population, no matter what profit it saw me. There are safer, well researched, much more rewarding chemicals out there.

The NBOMe thing became all about profit and no longer about the experience. A cheap thrill being passed around the playground, not a drug that will influence a generation. In fact, for a while there, I knew I was profiting mainly because people were bulk buying my stuff, and reselling it as acid. We had messages BEGGING for us to stop printing the chemical name on the back, even offers to pay more if we would do 'one last batch without'. Some customers actually became aggressive when we declined. This was not the crowd I wished to deal to, and not the life I want to lead.

Those of us in the position to know about these chemicals (and with the intelligence to lay sheets) should also be able to feel when something isn't quite right.

In the end, we flushed around 1.5KG of 25i/c down the toilet (that's worth over six figures retail) and decided to move on. I want to contribute to the psychedelic community, not take from it.

EDIT: To the NBOMe vendors. I am NOT judging you by any means. Our decisions were ours alone and reflect OUR opinion of the situation. Everyone is entitled to their own point of view. I do however urge you to label products correctly and ask yourselves, would you be selling so many if the tabs were clearly labelled and could not be passed off as acid - see the LSZ and AL-LAD tabs for examples. Oh, and laying 25i onto Hoffman or any other print associated with LSD is particularly bad.

Peace, everyone. Il be in the office with a changa spliff, reading organic chemistry for dummies and trying to source some ergotamine  8)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Vanquish on September 08, 2013, 06:04 am
but I cannot divert my attention from the reports of seizures and deaths that are coming in, and equally importantly, the opinions of highly experienced psychonauts who know their own minds and bodies better than many can ever possibly imagine.

I want to contribute to the psychedelic community, not take from it.

Thank you for your extremely well spoken and thoroughly accurate account of the entire situation and perspective seen through the eyes of everyone without preconceived bias.

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: khorne flake on September 08, 2013, 03:32 pm
Tyl3r is a badass!  You've got a buyer right here once you start producing crystal!
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: TSX on September 08, 2013, 09:45 pm
Thanks to wavelength and Tyl3rdurden from the first page.
Now I don't want to try the NBOMe group anymore. ;)

(About the psychedelic ass, it looks exactly like the penis sculpture from a clockwork orange!)
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: AuraithX on September 09, 2013, 11:26 pm
Closing up shop was not a decision we took lightly.
The money from vending was my only source of income, my life in fact.
We were at one point arguably the largest vendor on here (top 1%, 100% positive feedback) This should give you an idea of the volume we produced and the income we gave up. I estimate we distributed over 1,000,000 of these things.

There were two main issues which influenced my decision to stop.

1. It seems that different people have different reactions to this chemical. The odds that you will be the one who reacts badly are tiny, but a party is no longer a party if one person seizes out and dies.

Respected psychedelic users from various forums, notably Bluelight, of which I am a member, the shroomery, and other boards have all expressed their concern over this chemical.
I believe I am a logical person. I believe I think rationally. I know that many reported cases will involve abnormal factors such as high doses, irresponsible use, polydrug use, etc etc.
There are reports of this drug causing seizures and deaths (A few months back, one of our customers sent us a message to say he had experienced a seizure on one tab - no other drugs involved. We brushing it aside and moved along, figuring there must have been some other reason). A moderator on Bluelight took a normal dose of 25-c and performed regular blood pressure checks throughout (dangerously high). This was someone with a highly respected experience and understanding of tryps/phens and a decent understanding of neurochemistry and biology. They stated they wouldn't take it again. I have used the chemical multiple times and never had a bad experience, but I cannot divert my attention from the reports of seizures and deaths that are coming in, and equally importantly, the opinions of highly experienced psychonauts who know their own minds and bodies better than many can ever possibly imagine.


2. The second reason I decided to pull away from this is because of first hand experience of the attitudes of the younger generation towards drugs.
It can't be helped, this is just how they are. I gave a strip of 25i to a kid I am still friends with, who I met at a festival. A couple of weeks later he told me, laughing, 'I sold that research chemical stuff off to someone - just told them it was acid!'. I shook my head and just felt sad (yes I did try and explain why this was wrong but it seemed to go over his head)

This is the problem we face. It doesn't matter if I can convince myself, logically, that each and every user should be responsible for identifying the chemical they are about to ingest, and understand the safety aspects of it and the correct dosage, we at the top are feeding a system where we must expect this sort of thing to happen. Many will disagree with me here - and I fully understand, I was of the former school of thought this time last year.

If a chemical becomes something I would not want to share with a loved one, I would no longer wish to share it with the rest of the population, no matter what profit it saw me. There are safer, well researched, much more rewarding chemicals out there.

The NBOMe thing became all about profit and no longer about the experience. A cheap thrill being passed around the playground, not a drug that will influence a generation. In fact, for a while there, I knew I was profiting mainly because people were bulk buying my stuff, and reselling it as acid. We had messages BEGGING for us to stop printing the chemical name on the back, even offers to pay more if we would do 'one last batch without'. Some customers actually became aggressive when we declined. This was not the crowd I wished to deal to, and not the life I want to lead.

Those of us in the position to know about these chemicals (and with the intelligence to lay sheets) should also be able to feel when something isn't quite right.

In the end, we flushed around 1.5KG of 25i/c down the toilet (that's worth over six figures retail) and decided to move on. I want to contribute to the psychedelic community, not take from it.

EDIT: To the NBOMe vendors. I am NOT judging you by any means. Our decisions were ours alone and reflect OUR opinion of the situation. Everyone is entitled to their own point of view. I do however urge you to label products correctly and ask yourselves, would you be selling so many if the tabs were clearly labelled and could not be passed off as acid - see the LSZ and AL-LAD tabs for examples. Oh, and laying 25i onto Hoffman or any other print associated with LSD is particularly bad.

Peace, everyone. Il be in the office with a changa spliff, reading organic chemistry for dummies and trying to source some ergotamine  8)

Thanks for the response, I will xpost to bluelight and try and gather further details as to what is causing these issues. I respect your decision to stop selling. But if you've 1m tabs and had one bad report that's only 0.0001%. abstinence is a poor response - this will likely increase further in popularity so harm-reduction is my #1 priority

Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: Isobetadine on September 11, 2013, 02:15 am
Closing up shop was not a decision we took lightly.
The money from vending was my only source of income, my life in fact.
We were at one point arguably the largest vendor on here (top 1%, 100% positive feedback) This should give you an idea of the volume we produced and the income we gave up. I estimate we distributed over 1,000,000 of these things.

There were two main issues which influenced my decision to stop.

1. It seems that different people have different reactions to this chemical. The odds that you will be the one who reacts badly are tiny, but a party is no longer a party if one person seizes out and dies.

Respected psychedelic users from various forums, notably Bluelight, of which I am a member, the shroomery, and other boards have all expressed their concern over this chemical.
I believe I am a logical person. I believe I think rationally. I know that many reported cases will involve abnormal factors such as high doses, irresponsible use, polydrug use, etc etc.
There are reports of this drug causing seizures and deaths (A few months back, one of our customers sent us a message to say he had experienced a seizure on one tab - no other drugs involved. We brushing it aside and moved along, figuring there must have been some other reason). A moderator on Bluelight took a normal dose of 25-c and performed regular blood pressure checks throughout (dangerously high). This was someone with a highly respected experience and understanding of tryps/phens and a decent understanding of neurochemistry and biology. They stated they wouldn't take it again. I have used the chemical multiple times and never had a bad experience, but I cannot divert my attention from the reports of seizures and deaths that are coming in, and equally importantly, the opinions of highly experienced psychonauts who know their own minds and bodies better than many can ever possibly imagine.


2. The second reason I decided to pull away from this is because of first hand experience of the attitudes of the younger generation towards drugs.
It can't be helped, this is just how they are. I gave a strip of 25i to a kid I am still friends with, who I met at a festival. A couple of weeks later he told me, laughing, 'I sold that research chemical stuff off to someone - just told them it was acid!'. I shook my head and just felt sad (yes I did try and explain why this was wrong but it seemed to go over his head)

This is the problem we face. It doesn't matter if I can convince myself, logically, that each and every user should be responsible for identifying the chemical they are about to ingest, and understand the safety aspects of it and the correct dosage, we at the top are feeding a system where we must expect this sort of thing to happen. Many will disagree with me here - and I fully understand, I was of the former school of thought this time last year.

If a chemical becomes something I would not want to share with a loved one, I would no longer wish to share it with the rest of the population, no matter what profit it saw me. There are safer, well researched, much more rewarding chemicals out there.

The NBOMe thing became all about profit and no longer about the experience. A cheap thrill being passed around the playground, not a drug that will influence a generation. In fact, for a while there, I knew I was profiting mainly because people were bulk buying my stuff, and reselling it as acid. We had messages BEGGING for us to stop printing the chemical name on the back, even offers to pay more if we would do 'one last batch without'. Some customers actually became aggressive when we declined. This was not the crowd I wished to deal to, and not the life I want to lead.

Those of us in the position to know about these chemicals (and with the intelligence to lay sheets) should also be able to feel when something isn't quite right.

In the end, we flushed around 1.5KG of 25i/c down the toilet (that's worth over six figures retail) and decided to move on. I want to contribute to the psychedelic community, not take from it.

EDIT: To the NBOMe vendors. I am NOT judging you by any means. Our decisions were ours alone and reflect OUR opinion of the situation. Everyone is entitled to their own point of view. I do however urge you to label products correctly and ask yourselves, would you be selling so many if the tabs were clearly labelled and could not be passed off as acid - see the LSZ and AL-LAD tabs for examples. Oh, and laying 25i onto Hoffman or any other print associated with LSD is particularly bad.

Peace, everyone. Il be in the office with a changa spliff, reading organic chemistry for dummies and trying to source some ergotamine  8)

Thanks for the response, I will xpost to bluelight and try and gather further details as to what is causing these issues. I respect your decision to stop selling. But if you've 1m tabs and had one bad report that's only 0.0001%. abstinence is a poor response - this will likely increase further in popularity so harm-reduction is my #1 priority

Feel the same way.
People better start shoving medical records and detailed scientific studies in my face before i jump on the BANdwagon.

Other then that,selling it as something lsd should give the seller a bad trip he'll remember for the rest of his life as negative karma.
Worse if it results into bodily harm for the duped buyer.
Title: Re: The nbomb political pickle.
Post by: j1m1th1ng on September 16, 2013, 11:59 am
really selling a million tabs and one person have an bad reaction like seizing isn't crazy as far as bad reactions go.  I bet a lot of accepted drugs in society prob hurt or cause a serious negative reaction in more then 1 in a million.  If you where to invent some new food and one out a million or so people who it have a bad reaction to it does that mean you food is dangerous and no safe for market?  What % of kids have nut allergy's now?  I bet it way higher then a few in a million.  Yet peanuts still have pretty wide use in our society.  We are just aware to some people they can pose a danger and some caution should be took.  Thats how I see the 25x series.