Silk Road forums
Discussion => Shipping => Topic started by: ChanceyAsbury on May 02, 2012, 05:52 pm
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I've been receiving my packages at home--real address, real name. Should I get a PO Box/private mail box? I have no fake ID, so obviously I'm going to have to give my real name and home address to get the box, right? So I can't see any advantage to that.
The wiki says use a friend's house. I'm not going to have my contraband sent to a friend's house, that seems to me an absurd suggestion.
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One advantage is, if you ever have something arrive that for some reason needs to be signed for, the postal worker will sign for it for you. If you got busted, you could really use that to your advantage.
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so your wife doesnt know what your up to :D
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With a po box you can
-import using a company name
-have somebody sign for anything, won't be carded for p/u
-get a new address if you receive customs love letter
-nobody in your house/apt/trailer/tent will open the package if you're not around
Use a family business/private PO box.. no government one's.
Don't have to write PO BOX on the letter, simply write
Modern Records
#707 - 123 Street St.
City Postal code
USA
There ya go
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I thought about using a PO box for a couple of weeks. In the end though, I don't think it really makes it that much safer in the grand scheme of things. One very practical use for a PO box however, would be that your wife/girlfriend/partner would never open your package (and dump you), or throw it out (if in a fake, or previous tenants name). My girlfriend has no idea i'm getting illicit drugs sent to our address. Sometimes I feel quite guilty about that. The simple fact is that this place is way too good an opportunity to pass up, so i'm lucky that she never checks the mail for fear of another parking fine demand notice! haha. If I ever get a PO box, it will be so she doesn't find out what i'm doing.
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Every vendor that has been arrested for selling illicit substances online used a PO box. The police watched the person go in and physically get the mail.
PO Boxes are not very safe, but they are more reliable so there is a higher chance your mail will come. Also, it is just you and your mail so no issues with a relative/neighbor fucking with your mail.
If you're paranoid you'll need a physical proxy to get your mail. Either mail to their address, or have them go and get the mail from your PO box. I take this route, but being a vendor I have a reason to be excessively paranoid.
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Every vendor that has been arrested for selling illicit substances online used a PO box. The police watched the person go in and physically get the mail.
PO Boxes are not very safe, but they are more reliable so there is a higher chance your mail will come. Also, it is just you and your mail so no issues with a relative/neighbor fucking with your mail.
If you're paranoid you'll need a physical proxy to get your mail. Either mail to their address, or have them go and get the mail from your PO box. I take this route, but being a vendor I have a reason to be excessively paranoid.
What about all of the vendors who used fake ID boxes and didn't get busted because of it? One vendor who had 5 grams of crystal LSD seized and didn't go in to pick it up because the tracking said "Held by non-customs federal agency" comes to mind. He called from a burner phone from a random location to inquire about the status of his package, and they kindly informed him that they wanted to question him about a baggie of material that was discovered in his package. Another also comes to mind where hundreds of sheets to multiple people resulted in raids, and since everyone else who participated in that order got raided he decided not to go to his box to pick up his package. What about all the people who drop their boxes after they find out one of the people who they get shit from was arrested, making it so they don't give a fuck if the person gives shipping info to the feds. What about the fact that its harder for LE to put a bunch of fake ID box locations under constant manned surveillance than it is for them to log all of the addresses on outgoing mail from a vendor they put under surveillance. What about the fact that there is technically nothing stopping you from having vendors use broadcasting interception detection technology to alert you if your package has been opened in transit. What about the fact that they sign for the package for you ? What about the fact that if some asshole you order from decides to blackmail you with your address or spam your address, you can just drop the box and get another one? What about etc etc etc. Fake ID private mail boxes are the clear winner, but try to use in state ID if you can.
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What country did that happen?
Also, no [decent] wholesale vendor I know of ships with tracking. It is an interesting concept though.
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What I feel does not get discussed enough in these PO Box threads is potential consequences for the real home address on file (connected to the PO Box).
The only reason I would use a PO Box is to keep safe the drugs I have at home if I were to be caught.
However, (assuming you are using a real name and real address to sign up for the PO Box) if you are caught receiving drugs at a PO Box, does that allow LEO to get a search warrant for your home, your car, any property you have?? Or do they just search the PO Box and nothing else?
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What I feel does not get discussed enough in these PO Box threads is potential consequences for the real home address on file (connected to the PO Box).
The only reason I would use a PO Box is to keep safe the drugs I have at home if I were to be caught.
However, (assuming you are using a real name and real address to sign up for the PO Box) if you are caught receiving drugs at a PO Box, does that allow LEO to get a search warrant for your home, your car, any property you have?? Or do they just search the PO Box and nothing else?
They can and will search the registered address on the PO box if needed but unless you're buying bulk amounts I doubt they will but you never know. I use my PO box for personal amounts because I've had it for a while so if a package were to ever get intercepted I would just deny everything and play the ignorant card. However, I do use a PO registered under a fake name for bulk amount but it offers 24 hour access so I feel pretty safe about picking up my packages.
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What country did that happen?
Also, no [decent] wholesale vendor I know of ships with tracking. It is an interesting concept though.
Both happened in USA. Every wholesale vendor who offers refunds, partial refunds or reships on interceptions or lost packs requires tracking if the customer wants those benefits, especially when the packs have fifty thousand dollars worth of shit in them.
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What about all of the vendors who used fake ID boxes and didn't get busted because of it? One vendor who had 5 grams of crystal LSD seized and didn't go in to pick it up because the tracking said "Held by non-customs federal agency" comes to mind. He called from a burner phone from a random location to inquire about the status of his package, and they kindly informed him that they wanted to question him about a baggie of material that was discovered in his package. Another also comes to mind where hundreds of sheets to multiple people resulted in raids, and since everyone else who participated in that order got raided he decided not to go to his box to pick up his package. What about all the people who drop their boxes after they find out one of the people who they get shit from was arrested, making it so they don't give a fuck if the person gives shipping info to the feds. What about the fact that its harder for LE to put a bunch of fake ID box locations under constant manned surveillance than it is for them to log all of the addresses on outgoing mail from a vendor they put under surveillance. What about the fact that there is technically nothing stopping you from having vendors use broadcasting interception detection technology to alert you if your package has been opened in transit. What about the fact that they sign for the package for you ? What about the fact that if some asshole you order from decides to blackmail you with your address or spam your address, you can just drop the box and get another one? What about etc etc etc. Fake ID private mail boxes are the clear winner, but try to use in state ID if you can.
I do not have the ability to +1 this but I would if I could.
Tracking: I would like to know if USPS/USPIS can manually alter tracking screens/outcomes.
If tracking says things like "Held by non-customs federal agency," that implies it is an automatic system. I dislike writing that out in open-sourceland where they may suddenly figure out to change it, but anyone with five neurons would have figured out to change it by now anyway.
What is the disincentive, other than cost, to tracking? I can't see how it would appreciably raise one's profile. I'm a nonvendor and I ship most if not all packages with tracking now... What am I missing? It seems like it would reduce the risk of postal employee theft without incurring the risks to sender/buyer of insurance.
Curious: what does the tracking system say when mail goes to a recovery center?
Also, re: Sour D: share his or her interest about consequences for the IRL holders of POBs (and/or PMBs.) Can't find the code/statute re: this right now but I'm still looking.
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If tracking says things like "Held by non-customs federal agency,"
We were all quite surprised to see that they announced its interception on tracking, one guess is that it didn't test positive for coke/heroin etc in a field test and they were not sure what it was yet other than that it was a baggie of powder that wasn't declared. It was strange that some agency other than customs was holding it though. In most of the interception cases I am aware of, *something* strange happened with the tracking that indicated things were not normal, although that was the most blatant example. The second case I mention was more subtle though, for one all of the intercepted packages of people who were known to be raided said the packages were return to sender, however this update happened after the controlled deliveries went down. The people involved were aware of the controlled deliveries because the people ordering sent shit to the houses of their workers, not their own homes, so they never actually were busted and quickly got news of the CDs since many people were at the homes when it went down and even though everyone in each house was arrested many were released fairly quickly and got word back to them. The person who had shit sent to a fake ID box also had return to sender on his tracking shortly after the CD's went down, although he had already decided not to pick up his package since three other locations that were part of that bulk buy had been raided. Also all of the packs were awaiting customs clearance for quite a while longer than was expected, people actually were predicting there were interceptions prior to the CDs. Also for what it is worth, the dumbasses signed for the packs, and almost immediately after signing they were zerg rushed by shit tons of feds and local law enforcement.
There are other instances as well, but I have probably already said more than I should have :S. Even if they manage to totally hide any irregularities in tracking when interceptions take place, that is where interception detection technology still makes having fake ID boxes great for increasing security in the event of an interception. Unfortunately we still have no designs for these things available, they will be a true god send for bulk importers and make busts due to interception a thing of the past.
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What I feel does not get discussed enough in these PO Box threads is potential consequences for the real home address on file (connected to the PO Box).
The only reason I would use a PO Box is to keep safe the drugs I have at home if I were to be caught.
However, (assuming you are using a real name and real address to sign up for the PO Box) if you are caught receiving drugs at a PO Box, does that allow LEO to get a search warrant for your home, your car, any property you have?? Or do they just search the PO Box and nothing else?
You could always get a friend to open a PO Box for you, and even send junk-mail/free samples there. But i'm currently having issues with my PO Box not receiving any packages... :o
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I opened up a P.O. box with my real name, they made a copy of my I.D..., but the address on the ID isn't where I'm actually living. I got the P.O. box cus my girlfriend and roommate wouldn't be cool with me ordering hella drugs to our house, and not too many friends are cool with letting me ship stuff to their place
I've had 3 orders not arrive to the P.O. box... 2 from Skyy, and one from 3jane
I found a new good address that i can use, and I've had two successful international orders come in to that new address, so i think i'm just gonna cut my losses on the P.O. box
One thing i found strange is i never even got a customs letter to the P.O. box, and it wasn't bulk, one order was 5g and the others were ~2g..
I'm pretty sure I typed the address correctly..
Either way, I'm done with P.O. boxes
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With a po box you can
-import using a company name
-have somebody sign for anything, won't be carded for p/u
-get a new address if you receive customs love letter
-nobody in your house/apt/trailer/tent will open the package if you're not around
Use a family business/private PO box.. no government one's.
Don't have to write PO BOX on the letter, simply write
Modern Records
#707 - 123 Street St.
City Postal code
USA
There ya go
This is bang on. Post boxes have many advantages. While it may not insulate you from getting drug chargers any more than having them shipped to your house, the fact is it removes other variables from the equation.
No accidental opening by someone at your house and the ability to change address as often as you see fit is worth the money.
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With no option to use a PO Box is it really that dangerous to use your home address or a friends then if you stick to denying anything incriminating towards you if LE gets involved? Living in the middle of bum-fuck-nowhere is discouraging me from ordering from SR despite my numerous months of lurking the listings, drooling over what I've seen.
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I got a PO box because i cant use my home address, I have too much weed and too many bongs, plus my girlfriend and roommate would give me shit for ordering drugs to the house.
I've been kinda weary on using my PO box though, they've made a copy of my ID when i got it, and idk, its just too direct for my comfort.
Recently i found someone who's letting me use their house, their place is clean too so if there were to be a knock an talk or a warrant things wouldn't be very sketchy for the most part..
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Is your home address the same place where you connect to Silk Road via Tor? If your ISP is checking to see if any of it's customers are using the Tor network, and this info is shared with your local LE, then there may be questions about what you're doing on a network that's all about secrecy. You may be profiled because of your use of Tor; this may or may not mean that your local post office is taking extra interest in the mail coming to your house.
I don't know why you won't have your SR packages sent to your friend's house, it seems like a good way to keep your anonymity.
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Anyone can send anyone stuff through the mail. If shit hits the fan, saying "Lawyer" is better than putting your trust in friends.
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The main benefit I can see is that of being able to let your mail sit for months at a time without you being anywhere near it. The police's resources can easily accommodate a week's worth of surveillance on a post office, which is all the time you get to pick up an undelivered package before it's sent back to the return address.
Wait a few months and at best you'll get your package safe and sound, at worst you'll open up the box and find nothing because the cops abandoned the sting.
However... one thing I've been pondering is whether or not they'd resort to GPS chipping your package if you didn't show up for a couple of weeks and they couldn't justify any more hours spent watching a PO box. A little Faraday cage would solve the GPS tracking issue, but I'm sure they would have someone regularly checking to see if it was physically there, and you could expect a raid on your house the second they noticed it missing. That's where a fake ID would come into play.
I seriously doubt they would ever bother doing any of that for a package worth less than a grand, so it's never been a big worry for me.
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Wait a few months and at best you'll get your package safe and sound, at worst you'll open up the box and find nothing because the cops abandoned the sting.
While I agree with this, no one (excluding anomalies) wants to wait for their drugs for 6 months. Buying some acid for 2013 is beyond the scope of most of us.
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That's exactly why I just order straight to my house in my own name. With the small amounts I'm ordering, the police would need to either be desperate for busts or have a grudge with me to bother raiding my house.
The good thing about getting it sent straight to you is that it's incredibly difficult to convict someone based on the fact that SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE, FOR SOME REASON sent drugs to you. The less suspicious effort on your part that can be documented (fake IDs, fake business names etc.) the more innocent you look before a court, to the point where they'll just try to pressure you into admitting you ordered it and when that fails, not even bothering to try to convict).
I'm just discussing personal use amounts here though, if I was ordering any significant amount of illegal substance or any amount of class A drugs at all, I'd go with the combination of a fake ID, a PO box and a few torturous months of waiting.
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Is your home address the same place where you connect to Silk Road via Tor? If your ISP is checking to see if any of it's customers are using the Tor network, and this info is shared with your local LE, then there may be questions about what you're doing on a network that's all about secrecy. You may be profiled because of your use of Tor; this may or may not mean that your local post office is taking extra interest in the mail coming to your house.
Really...? I've never heard of this, do you have any proof or examples?
It was my understanding that ISPs don't give the slightest fuck what their customers are doing, because they are just that, customers. They won't go out of their way to monitor you and if they happen to see something out of the ordinary, they won't pursue it, because why lose hundreds of dollars a month? Now of course, they're required to hand over your docs at LE request with a warrant/subpoena, but I'm willing to bet if they didn't have to, a few companies would just tell them to fuck off. Just what I've heard through the grapevine, don't quote me on any of this.
Also, I've never really seen a definitive answer, obviously signing for anything is at best, a huge risk, at worst, suicide. Either way it's an incredibly stupid thing to do, CD or not. But if they DO attempt a CD and you refuse the package, is that the end of it? I'm sure they'd watch you for a bit, and certainly flag your mail (that's when it's time to stop) but would they have to give up if they didn't have enough evidence or probable cause? No proof you intended to receive anything, and refusing it means it's not in your possession. That seems like one of the few upsides of using a home address to me, PO box might mean you have no idea if they're waiting for you to pick it up or not, and also means no time to destroy any evidence if they are.
Controlled deliveries are honestly kind of BS, most normal people would sign for anything even if they weren't expecting it. Is there truly ANY proof they intended to receive it or knew what it contained, other than possession? Obviously that's what the subsequent search is for, but it seems like an easy way to fuck someone over, be it your worst enemy or a total stranger.
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too many people have access to my mailbox so i just went and got a PO box under my real name. however my license states an old address so they dont have my real address. i also connected "my business" to it. i made up a business name called "Ipod Tech" so i dont have to use my name when sending to it. i also signed up for some free bussiness/technical magazines on a magazine that offers free subscriptions to shitty magazines that nobody has heard of. i think that the business name in combination with the computer/technical magazines i will be getting makes it pretty stealthy. it wont be out of the ordinary to be getting small packages because people will think its electronic parts etc.
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With no option to use a PO Box is it really that dangerous to use your home address or a friends then if you stick to denying anything incriminating towards you if LE gets involved? Living in the middle of bum-fuck-nowhere is discouraging me from ordering from SR despite my numerous months of lurking the listings, drooling over what I've seen.
If you use domestic only for the first few times at least, you will have no problems. Its that leap of faith we all take.
With so many packages going in and out, its nothing. Just make sure you use your real name and real address, or friends real name and real address. Blend it into your other mail, no problems whatsoever. Its when there are various indicators, such as a fake name, abandoned address, that you start attracting attention to yourself.