Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: davebowman on March 16, 2012, 12:01 am
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I hope this is in the right sub-forum. Anyway, I was thinking about strategies to potentially aid myself in giving up the cigarettes. I realize that if I really didn't want to be smoking I would just stop,a triumph of the will, but evidently I have not made that choice thus far. There are many legitimate methods available in the world to ease myself through it but just for speculations sake, I wanted to bring up some more creative ideas involving less legitimate drugs and ask if anyone else has relevant experience or ideas to offer.
First off, I've heard that some people replace it with weed. This would not work for me because I have recently outgrown weed after smoking it constantly for over five years. It simply does not appeal to me now whatsoever.
My main idea was to go on a meth binge and sleep off the nicotine withdrawal. I have found that after spending a few days and nights on amphetamines, and then after sleeping for a prolonged period of time, I desire cigarettes considerably less when I wake up. Until now, I've made a psychological choice every time to keep smoking, but I feel like the acute, unpleasant feeling of the absence of cigarettes is diminished if I don't smoke for a day because I was asleep the whole time. I realize nicotine withdrawal is short lived and I feel this could help if I did make a psychological choice not to smoke after. Plus, the meth binge itself could be a very enjoyable, climactic farewell to cigarettes, chain smoking my last pack while tweaking hard.
I just wanted to throw that out there and ask if anyone has any other ideas or experience substituting cigarettes with something less detrimental. (I realize meth is probably more detrimental if it became a habitual thing, but I'm thinking in terms of sporadic use.)
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If you can quit without using anything else, I would suggest you do that. As for something to help you quit if you can't otherwise, I'd suggest a psychedelic of some sort. When I snorted 2C-I, I didn't take any other drugs for almost 3 months. I then had to specifically choose to get back into them. YMMV, though.
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Personally, I had a really really messy week, which culminated in taking a large dose of acid (first time I'd taken it -was amazing ;)),
and since that week/during that trip, it suddenly dawned on me to quit smoking cigarettes and take some time out, probably changed my personality a fair bit.... but yeh, I found that acid pretty much made me stop then and there, haven't smoked cigarettes since, unless I'm drunk or rolling, when it's acceptable...
good luck man,
it's really rewarding once you realise that you don't smoke anymore
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The only thing that I know works is weed but yeah you're burnt out. Maybe you could try vaping?
I do not think chain smoking while tweaking will be helpful. A big part of nicotine addiction is psychological and you aren't doing yourself any good by making your last memory of cigarettes an amazingly euphoric experience. You may have diminished cravings in the short term but it's unlikely to last.
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Wellbutrin
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A while back, I took Adderall for a week. I stopped smoking that week, and several days that followed. I also stopped smoking when I took meth recently.
I can't give any solid advice to your situation, though. My smoking habits are too sporadic to consider myself a sample in any smoking data pool.
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Buproprion
It's an anti-depressant goes by name of Wellbutrin and it's tradename for smoking cessation is Zyban.
It will KILL your desire to smoke in that smokes will taste fucking nasty and you generally just wont want them, plus like I said its an anti-depressant which I imagine would be helpful when quiting.
The therapeutic dose for anti-depression is typically 150mg bid (300mg a day). I don't know what dose range they use for smoking cessation alone but imagine it's much lower. It's a very good anti-depressant if you ask me cuz it hits dopaminergic and adrenergic, but not serotogenic neurons (for many ppl, myself included, SSRIs, the ones that hit serotogenic in specific there are some .... unacceptable side affects, like for example not being able to get an erection even with viagra), so its good if you have past history with anti-depressants and know your reactions.
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bupropion: They use the same dose range as for an antidepressant. 150 mg of bupropion SR every morning for 2-4 days, then 150 mg every morning and every afternoon (or your morning/afternoon). Not everyone needs to go to 300mg.
Don't take it at night or it'll keep you awake. It gets erroneously rx'ed as twice-per-day and taken at morning/bedtime, then people hate it because they can't sleep.
Not good if bulimic (or a daily vomiter/purger for some other esoteric reason) - risk for seizures is a legit concern in that situation.
Recommended to take it for about 10-14 days before your planned quit date, but seems like cigarettes suddenly taste bad before that.
Don't quit smoking and THEN start the bupropion.
Worked pretty well for the smokers in my world, although they had pressing motivation - new babies, health stuff, being stuck in a hospital without a choice for 2 weeks before surgery, things like that.
Decent antidepressant and ADD effects too, if that's relevant. (Sorry, I don't have first hand experience on this one for its smoking cessation effects. I know it for psych effects, though.)
The SR form in the US should be <$40/#60 tablets at a retail pharmacy, less at the warehouse stores.
I've known a fair number of people who've come to the point of making the jump, had a kind of clarifying episode with psychedelic of choice, then started bupropion.
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Maybe it was just my personal experience, but I was on Wellbutrin XR 300mg a day for about 3 years, and it did nothing to lessen my nicotine cravings. Never stopped, and still haven't.
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Here in australia we have a product called "champix" and its so good at quitting smoking. Some people can't take it like those who have mental issues but man it works. I didnt even have will power only took half recommended dosage and was fully quit within 3 months of taking champix. Havent even had a draw since, which is about 2 years now. Look into it! Prescribed from the doctor by pfizer.
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Maybe it was just my personal experience, but I was on Wellbutrin XR 300mg a day for about 3 years, and it did nothing to lessen my nicotine cravings. Never stopped, and still haven't.
Have you tried Varenicline out to help you quit? It's supposed to be another good smoking cessation drug, it goes by the name brand name Chantix and i've heard some ppl who've quit swear by it, but i've never tried it myself
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No, I haven't. I've heard good things about Chantix. Maybe I'll look into it.
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Chantix love their commercial of 60 seconds of side effects
nausea,constipation,gas,vomiting,heartburn,bad taste in the mouth
increased or decreased appetite,trouble falling asleep or staying asleep
unusual dreams or nightmares,headache,suicidal thoughts,suicide
swelling of the face, throat, tongue, lips, gums, eyes, neck, hands, arms, feet, ankles, or lower legs
hoarseness,difficulty swallowing or breathing,rash
swollen, red, peeling, or blistering skin,blisters in the mouth,pain, squeezing, or pressure in the chest
pain or discomfort in one or both arms, back, neck, jaw, or stomach
difficulty in moving your arms or legs,shortness of breath,sweating
nausea, vomiting, or lightheadedness,slow or difficult speech
weakness or numbness of an arm or leg, especially on one side of the body
may cause other side effects. Call your doctor if you have any unusual problems while taking this medication.
You're better off smoking than with this poison
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Champix binds to the same receptors as nicotine (although slightly different - don't ask me how, I'm no doctor ;) ), this seems to work really well. As above poster posted, it has some annoying side effects but might be worth if it makes you quit really well.
I've found myself quitting a couple of times, even some prolonged times and never found the nicotine withdrawal an issue. It's mostly the habit of lighting a cigarette when you're bored/stressed/after dinner/etc that is hard to kick. If you think nicotine is the issue, get your nicotine in a different form (patches work fine, chewinggum is nasty as shit) and try to kick the habit first.
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I also had this problem.. ... have accomplished it a couple times for over 5 days. I then relapse. I haven't smoked for 2 months now and have no intention of ever doing it again. (Cigars are ok on occasion)
(Never Done meth) but I don't think Meth would help you with anything.... its not a good thing.
Adderall made me chain smoke!!! don't take adderall with the intention of stopping smoking. I smoked 10 cigs in a 4 hour period thanks to adderall.
It's all mental my friend. The best advice I can give you is to resesarch smokers lungs and tobacco effects on the internet.... that shit can scare you. I looked at some shit and it realy scared the shit out of me, havn't picked up a cig since.
Good luck
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Wellbutrin
Bammm!
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I consider myself a heavy smoker and i tried Chantix. It really is amazing how you lose the craving. Had some mild sidefx but nothing to serious. Did start again after 3 months but that was more a motivational issue.
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Mushrooms made me thinking how stupid smoking is... I used to be heavy smoker, but now I'm not smoking anymore. I realized that "normal" industrial tobacco has nothing to do with real tobacco. It contains over 4000 unnecessary chemicals etc. So first I switched to additive free tobacco(American Spirit). Try it for a while and you'll find out that "normal" tobacco really tastes like shit. Approx. 6 months later I decided to quit smoking completely and it was not hard at all. I used to eat some sunflower seeds when I was carving nicotine. They contain some compounds that mimic some of the effects of nicotine. Every one should also read book called The Easy Way to Stop Smoking by Allen Carr. It really helped me to keep my decision... Just quit, you don't lose anything by doing it.
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All you need is the power of WANTING to quit. If you don't really want to quit, you're not going to quit. Drugs help some people quit, but you're not going to unless you really want to.
Also this book :http://www.amazon.com/Allen-Carrs-Easy-Stop-Smoking/dp/0760727325/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1334890422&sr=8-1
I'm serious. Read this book and you will quit. No bullshit. You're supposed to smoke while you read it too.
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Selegiline really cuts down on my cravings, and when I do try and smoke it makes me sick (so does weed smoke).
I'm a casual smoker, I usually pick up the habit when I'm on tolerance break from weed (420 in 11 hrs and I'm 2weeks clean!)
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I'll repeat it because it works: Bupropion (Wellbutrin). I have had no interest in smoking since taking it.
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I took Wellbutrin briefly for depression and I remember it made me sick. Definitely I need to decide to quit in order to quit. There ain't no easy way out. Maybe I could induce amnesia somehow and forget I ever was a smoker...
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I quit cold turkey after 1 pack a day for 2-3 years, it was pretty easy
I guess you gotta be mentally prepared for it
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http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2615322/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NMDA_receptor_antagonist
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I think what your talking about Xe is basically Namenda.
You might have a easier time getting your doctor to prescribe Namenda over ketamine, or methadone.
But there is a lot promising research involving dissociative drugs in the treatment of drug addiction.
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I think what your talking about Xe is basically Namenda.
You might have a easier time getting your doctor to prescribe Namenda over ketamine, or methadone.
But there is a lot promising research involving dissociative drugs in the treatment of drug addiction.
I don't believe in doctors, any addiction is a private issue to me..
I'm talking exactly about precious dissociatives, aesthetic anesthetics..
Personally i used dxm to break my nicotine craving with great success..
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Like other people are saying, really wanting to quit is key. Something about your mindset changes completely and all of a sudden you forget to smoke more and more often. But it can be really hard when all of your friends smoke because then you're constantly reminded of it and it's a 'social' activity ..
in which case I guess I would also recommend wellbutrin. Although I took wellbutrin awhile after I quit smoking, I remember the though of smoking a cigarette being completely nauseating which I guess should do the trick.
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Nicotine is a bad bad wonderful poison. I remember after smoking my first ciggie at 13 just laying in bed smelling my fingers all night like it was the smell of pussy. Also I combine it with the best days of my life and conversation as well as meeting beautiful girls. Further smoking makes you never feel lonely, when I'm walking alone outside smoking a cigarette it feels like a companion by my side. I quit because I do get colds all the time from smoking, like to exercise and smoking does make me very stressed. It was not that bad quitting everyday smoking it is just as soon as you drink or do any kind of party drug or even psychedelic I want a cigarette. Several of times I relapsed because nicotine is a sneaky motherfucker, you quit for 2 month then you have a small drag one night and next thing you know you back to were you started. Addiction is always there and you can never make it less only ignore it. It is not hard to quit but very easy to start again. As soon as you take a drag you just want more especially if you drinking or doing mdma/speed. I do not believe in nicotine gums/etc for that reason, champix and other medication give you the most horrible dreams and are probably not good for you. I wonder if I ever going to completely feel that I wont need a ciggie even when I'm drinking.
My advice is go cold turkey, do not do any major amounts of drugs/alcohol for a long long time
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What keeps you craving for tobacco is not so much the nicotine itself, but the habits and thought-constructs you built unconsciously around it. And here comes the cool part: If you really want to quit smoking, I emphasize: If you REALLY want to, you can do this simply by reading this book:
Allen Carr's Easyway to stop smoking.
Some good soul might get you a free copy online ;)
I smoked for 5 years up to 4 packs a day and just the thought of not beeing able to smoke made me sweat. I read that book and never touched any smokes again since the 17th September 2001. I never even had to force myself not to smoke. That was quite a gift. I still like LSD though ;)
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Take a look at whyquit.com specifically their free ebook "Never Take Another Puff." Lots of good info.
Have you worked with an e-cig at all. They even now sell disposable ones for $8 at 7-11.
What you can try is decreasing your cigarette smoking and increasing your e-cig vaping. What i noticed with the e-cig is that it is NOT a substitute for smoking, but better than the patch or gum. I think cigarettes have additives that make the nicotine hit more potent/addictive. So when i smoke the e-cig i always felt like i wasn't getting satisfied in some way. Like i was expecting that all common "ahh" feeling after taking a drag from a real cig.
After a few weeks you stop missing the "hit" of cigarettes. Its a sacrafise to switch to the ecig (at least for me). But after that, I was able to stop vaping altogether. I think the ecig is easier to quit than the real cigs.
But i suggest that whatever you do, you go cold turkey. there is no such thing as titration with nicotine. Its VERY potent and it doesn't work like opiods or benzos which you would ween yourself off from. Just one cig will light up all the addictive circuitry.
After you manage to quit, REMEMBER: nicotine is VERY potent. Even years later, a single cigarette will reawaken all the cravings.
I took benzos for about 2 weeks. I got them from my doctor. Just go in and tell him that you've been trying to quit but you can't handle the anxiety. read up a bit on benzos first.
Also, the anti-depressant welbutrin is great. You have to take it for a month before it starts to work, but somehow it blocks part of the reward mechanism when you smoke. And best part is it gradually takes affect over that month. I suggest starting out with a low dose of it (150 mg/day) for a month to see how it affects you b/c it can cause some bad side effects for some (read up)
Smoking weed can help too, unless it some how makes you want to smoke cigs.
Hope that helps. Remember, it only takes about a week to quit. After about a week the cravings become far fewer and much less intense. Typical cravings last only 3 minutes. So keep a watch and when you feel and intense craving look at the watch and remind yourself that you only have to resist for 3 minutes and it will be over. Take it one craving at a time. Make your goal something doable, like "i won't smoke today" and repeat it every day. The goal of "i'm never going to smoke again" can only be accomplished after your dead. Have a daily goal instead so you can win every day.
Good luck and remember nicotine has been shown to be more addictive than heroin.
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I was up to about 2 and 1/2 packs a day of Marlboro Reds a day before I finally tried to quit in earnest. Patches didn't work, gums didn't work. Finally went to the doctor and was prescribed Chantix. They gave me 3 months worth but it only ended up taking about 1 and a 1/2. You can keep smoking for the first week while it kicks in. Afterwards you notice you stop really caring if you smoke or not. After about a month I couldn't even stand the smell of cig smoke and trying to smoke one made me gag like when I was a kid. It really seemed to work well but be aware it may cause some really, really weird dreams( similar to malaria medications).
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If you want some leverage to help you get by, there are alternative things you can smoke to help ease you through the withdrawals and eventually eliminate the habit altogether.
1) Cigars(Not healthier, but if you just puff on them for a few weeks they're a great way of leaning yourself off cigarettes).
2) Hookah- you can smoke shisha. It's cheaper than cigarettes and depending on the brand you smoke can be a lot healthier. Shisha is delicious and will give you a nice light-headed almost buzz-like feeling that cigarettes could never give you(if you're a long time smoker at least). There are heavier shisha's like starbuzz that supply you with a little bit of nicotine and tobacco. And then there are brands like beamer that have no nicotine, no tobacco and are purely made of molasses. The healthier brands still taste great but aren't as strong. Hookah smoking is great because as you lean off cigarettes and lean into the hookah you will find that you are smoking much less often(because hookah's aren't exactly portable) and are more of a social thing that you do with other people, rather than by yourself 20 times a day. If you took the hookah route to quitting cigs, I recommend you start of with the stronger stuff and as you become more accustomed to the hookah and start to forget the cigarettes you can lower yourself down to the lighter, healthier stuff.
I also recommend trying some smoking herbs. My favorite herb that got me the closest to almost quitting is called Lobelia Inflata. It is a natural herb that has been used for hundreds of years. In the olden days it was used to treat asthma, allergies, bronchitis and respiratory related illness'.
Now it is more popularly known as a good way to quit cigarettes. You can buy it in pill form, but I prefer the smoking form.
The key to lobelia is that it's a stimulant with properties very similar to nicotine, so when used it can trick the body into thinking it's getting nicotine. It has healing effects as well, as it helps clean out your system of all that mucus you've been storing up from all those years of smoking.
Some tips about smoking it = if your body is not used to it and you smoke too much at once it may cause vomitting(I personally never experienced it) but many claim that when they indulged in an excessive amount of it without building a tolerance they have puked.
It's kind of funny actually, in the 19th century it was a very commonly used medicine often referred to as "Puke Weed" because doctors would prescribe it to sick people with stomach viruses and such as a way to puke out the poisons in their stomach. If you want to read more about it just google it there is plenty information on it.
I gotta warn you it tastes like ass at first, but with in a day or two of smoking it it'll taste just fine. I really like the stuff, I've been trying very hard to quit both cigarettes and weed lately and lobelia really helps. It suppresses my nicotine craving and also gives me a little bit of a light buzz(not a strong high like weed supplies but a light, somewhat euphoric, clear-headed experience).
It's easy to find it in pill form but very difficult to find it in smoking form.
The website I found that sells it in smoking form is www.mountainroseherbs.com
If you make any progress please post it on this thread, I'd like to hear a good story about someone quitting smoking and as odd as it sounds it may provide me with a little encouragement to hear a success story.
Good luck!
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psychedelics can be really beneficial for addiction, as they allow you to get to the root of the problem. i'd recommend lsd and shrooms.
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psychedelics can be really beneficial for addiction, as they allow you to get to the root of the problem. i'd recommend lsd and shrooms.
This here.^^
back in the day I once took some very good acid and stared at a cigarette for an unknown length of time and it appeared to me to be the ugliest thing I had seen up to that point. As a result, I quit smoking and didn't pick one up for two years after that.
I quit again recently with no chemical help, just the realization of the toll they were taking on me.
Good luck with quitting :)
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psychedelics can be really beneficial for addiction, as they allow you to get to the root of the problem. i'd recommend lsd and shrooms.
This here.^^
back in the day I once took some very good acid and stared at a cigarette for an unknown length of time and it appeared to me to be the ugliest thing I had seen up to that point. As a result, I quit smoking and didn't pick one up for two years after that.
I quit again recently with no chemical help, just the realization of the toll they were taking on me.
Good luck with quitting :)
This happened to me on a 5 gram shroom trip. I was suffocated by each inhalation, and I had one of those "Why am I doing this?" moments. Nonetheless, I started smoking again after the shrooms wore off. :-[
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quit smoking by getting addicted to pills. yey!
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chantix/varenicline works really well and quickly. same pattern with two friends: cut down to a few cigarettes within a few days and totally quit within weeks. worth a shot if not only for a month, since it takes a month to break a habit anyway. good luck (in the meantime, use those little nicblock/targaurd plastic tip filters or the reusable one hunter s thompson is known for, but u have to clean it)
I don't think that the one HST used was a filter, it was just a cigarette holder (or a one hitter, ha)
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Im chewing a piece of the nicotine gum right now and also trying to quit cigs. Fucking gum sucks! Im dying for a smoke!
Man taking a nice long drag on a cig as soon as you inhale that shit hits your brain and life is good. This gum sucks nut sack. Its been 4 days since my last cig....can you tell im a little pissy????
Anyway, its the same with coke. Sniffing a line is cool, but smoke some freebase and its like BOOM!
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Im chewing a piece of the nicotine gum right now and also trying to quit cigs. Fucking gum sucks! Im dying for a smoke!
Man taking a nice long drag on a cig as soon as you inhale that shit hits your brain and life is good. This gum sucks nut sack. Its been 4 days since my last cig....can you tell im a little pissy????
Anyway, its the same with coke. Sniffing a line is cool, but smoke some freebase and its like BOOM!
I'll never understand nicotine. I've tried getting into it but the small buzz just didn't justify the ridiculous cost for each pack. I burned through a couple packs and never felt cravings either
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Only 1 thing can help you quit, your WILL POWER.
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Apparently iboga root is very effective against addictions in general. I read about heavy smokers that stopped after a treatment.
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Ive been looking into an iboga trip. I like the idea of using a drug to change some of the bad habits/addictions i have in my life, but a part of me feels like I have it in me already and dont need a drug to make it happen.
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I quit smoking last year after a hefty lsd trip told me to quit same thing with my friend on the same trip he also quit the day after. Doubt this will work for all, but somehow we got an epiphany at the same time. Where the lds somehow told us we shouldn't smoke cigarettes any more. Haven't smoked a cig since then
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I had an epiphany on lsd about cigs myself. It was towars the end of my trip and i felt with each drag that i was poisoning myself. I could feel it in my lungs and it was just a nasty this is fucked up feeling. I vowed to quit that night.........
Fast forward 10+ years and im still smoking. Oh btw i bought a pack of cigs this morning fml.
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Hey that is exactly what happened to us. That feeling in the lungs was just nasy.