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Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: qrbr6 on May 19, 2013, 10:12 am

Title: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: qrbr6 on May 19, 2013, 10:12 am
Background: I was taking 200mg a night for 4 weeks before I decided it was time to wean myself off to avoid any serious dependency issues or withdrawals down the road.

The first week I took 100mg a night, I felt very tired the first few days. Now into my second week, and I'm taking 50mg a night and only felt sluggish going from 100mg to 50mg for one day. My next step is to either do 25mg for a week or alternatively 50mg every second day. So this thread is basically to give my experience of Tramadol withdrawals, and for anyone else who wishes to add their experiences, good or bad. I should note that the only side effect I have ever felt aside from extreme fatigue was a very high heart rate three times (twice last week from walking up some stairs, even though I am quite fit, and waking up once from a very frightening nightmare {which may be normal anyway}).
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: tree on May 19, 2013, 04:58 pm
I didn't know tramadol had such withdrawals O.o Good luck getting off!
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: qrbr6 on May 19, 2013, 05:27 pm
As with any drug the withdrawals vary a lot from person to person. I consider myself lucky seeing as though others have had it tougher than I have so far.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 20, 2013, 01:21 am
It should not have such withdrawal problems, but then again, 200 mg a day for 4 weeks is more than most people typically use.

Tapering off seems like a good idea though, especially if you can get smaller doses somehow - the only ones i've ever used were 100 mg each gel capsules that don't look like breaking them in half would be a good idea.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: qrbr6 on May 20, 2013, 03:25 pm
I've actually heard a lot of instances about people having horrific withdrawals from this drug. Just go to google or something.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: wasta on May 20, 2013, 06:53 pm
It is a opiate.
Nothing new.

Dis-forming the receptors so pain can not be given trough the nerve.
A lot of pain comes along with it, so you get a nice feeling fro your body, so you feel nice things....until the opiate stops doing it's work.
Then your body finds out that the recepptors are disfomed and give signals like your nerves have been or still are under a buss (make it a red double-decker)

Once the receptors in your nerverves are in order again, you will feel no pain anymore.

Be prepared to feel the pain where the nerves are in large quantity's.
Like lips, the soles of your feet, your spine, fingertips etc.
When in a encoutner of a withdrawal, you should take your socks of.
Sleep with your feet outside the bed.
The skin is a very good organ to detox your body, so sweat those poisons out!

I know you havn't have the strenght, but it helps.

TRY IT !

Even wet dreams will come again, rather sooner then later.
Just a body- function, don't think to much of it.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 21, 2013, 12:46 am
Technically its an opoid rather than an opiate, but i suppose that doesn't matter very much in practical use.

As for withdrawal problems: those can definitely present, i'd compare it to codeine to some degree. Tramadol does not provide the instant high like morphine or heroin does at all, but it does work on the same receptors, and sudden cessation of use can certainly be problematic. You'll probably not crave the drug specifically, but just feel generally weak, shitty and ill for a bit. Tapering off doses will help greatly with that though, as long as you take it slow enough.

The problem with tramadol is that it actually works very well as an painkiller, but if you end up using it for only that purpose for several weeks you can find yourself in trouble of dependence already.

Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: qrbr6 on May 21, 2013, 07:40 am
Update: I'm able to exercise again, not feeling that tired anymore. I do want to sleep a lot of a morning though.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 22, 2013, 01:41 am
Sounds good man... keep it up!
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: sclerogal on May 22, 2013, 03:02 am
Unfortunately, Tramadol is mixed with other components, I'm not sure what they are, but that pain killer is linked to seizures unlike other opiate pain killers.   Please google it, you find info on the clearnet
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 23, 2013, 12:29 am
Tramadol from what source is supposed to be mixed with unwanted substances?

If you get it from a reputable brand as genuine tablets there is a complete list of all ingredients in the capsules provided in the leaflet. These would obviously list the gelcaps themselves and any colorants used to mark them, but besides that there seems to be little interesting in them.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: sclerogal on May 23, 2013, 01:02 am
I am speaking of the reputable brands, there are other ingredients in the medication that have been linked to seizures, this is unlike other opiate/opioid  medication.  You can refer to the wiki for more information; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tramadol  Patients have stated that withdrawals from this opioid is worse than some of the stronger opiates.  You'll find more information on Blulight, and other drug forums.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: tree on May 23, 2013, 05:03 pm
Tramadol itself can cause seizures. Binders and fillers are obviously not hazardous!
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: sclerogal on May 23, 2013, 05:18 pm
Actually you are correct, Tramodal it's self can cause seizures.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 24, 2013, 12:42 am
It can - it is by no means an innocent substance despite being available over the counter in many countries. These are usually 50 mg capsules though, with a leaflet that states some upper limit (like 3 a day) depending on what country you buy them in.

Then again there are plenty of countries where tramdol is not readily available and counterfeit products end up on the market as well. This still leaves the issue with withdrawal open a bit: were you actually taking tramadol, or something different sold as such?
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: sclerogal on May 24, 2013, 02:49 am
That's a part of the problem, they do not regulate medications overseas like we do and here in the US.  Also, the standards can change country to country, especially for those countries which are not part of European Union.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Churchwarden on May 24, 2013, 02:54 am
The other problem is here, overseas, they don't prescribe any good ADD meds so it's impossible to get adderall and Ritalin. I reserve the right to drink all night and still be able to function the next day through the use of prescription amphetamines.

In all seriousness though, good luck man. Opiates(oids?) get a hold of you fast and try not to let go.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: chemdog on May 24, 2013, 11:29 am
You have my sympathy.

Whoever is recommending Tramadol as a painkiller for mild to moderate pain should be shot. After having their fingers slammed in the door of a car.

I do not doubt its effectiveness in that capacity.

What pisses me off is the Pharma's, pharmacists and doctors don't know a damn thing about it, yet push it around like its asprin.

* It raises the threshold of a seizure when you take it and lowers it when you stop. Hence stopping CT from a high dose can be extraordinarily dangerous.

* Tramadol, while a mild opioid itself, is a pro-drug for the metabolite O-Desmethyltramadol. This is the funky lovely feeling that kicks in after about 2 - 3 hours. It is a strong opi in its own right, hence the ACMD having a fit about its sale as a legal high.

* This is the bit I wish I knew from day one: It seems to have an SSRI-like effect. Getting ANY professional in the medical scene (wait - there are professionals in the NHS??? ;-) ) to admit this is nigh on futile. The pharmacists only know what they are told via Patient Information Leaflets, leaving the heady days of org-chem long behind them.

When I stopped Tramadol, it felt like my life ended inside. I don't mean pain or withdrawl or anything.

I literally felt dead. This horrible sense of a black hole where my emotions were. And it lasted weeks and weeks. I've done enough opi dt's to know that isn't really normal. Emotions come back v quick.

The best thing I can suggest for you is exercise your ass off if you can.

If you are going through hell...

KEEP GOING!

:-)

+1
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 25, 2013, 12:45 am
You have my sympathy.

Whoever is recommending Tramadol as a painkiller for mild to moderate pain should be shot. After having their fingers slammed in the door of a car.

I do not doubt its effectiveness in that capacity.

What pisses me off is the Pharma's, pharmacists and doctors don't know a damn thing about it, yet push it around like its asprin.

You have to consider the options though. If a patient comes in with moderate pain, there is only a limited selection of treatments to choose from for a doctor. The first line would probably be paracetamol or some nsiad, but those may not be effective in acceptable doses, and/or cause severe GI complications.

In such cases there is little choice for the next suitable medicine: tramadol or codeine. Both are opiods and potentially addictive, but there is nothing in between that is generally available.

If it is by any means possbile pain from trauma should be managed with nsiads, but those really do have their limitations. If you, as suggested, broke your fingers in a car door, it would not be likely that the upper safe dose of any nsiad would provide relief. Obviously the patient can be offered the option of enduring it while on the maximum dose of diclofenac, or switch to tramadol which would be more effective and have less GI risks, but carries the risk of addiction.

I do suppose information provided to patients could be improved though: If you are option for tramadol you should be made aware that it has risks of dependence which are virtually absent in all nsiads.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: qrbr6 on May 25, 2013, 05:36 am
I'm up to 25mg a day now but forgot to dose last night but I feel fine now. I think I have successfully weaned off it but will go back to 25mg if I start to feel bad.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 27, 2013, 01:30 am
You're probably free of it really - 25 mg is a very small dose that would hardly be effective to treat any symptoms.

There is no reason you should not take 25 mg dosages until you feel comfortable to quit tramadol entirely, but that would be mostly of psychological reasons. Biologically 25 mg is a more or less ineffective dose for both pain relief and addiction.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: qrbr6 on May 29, 2013, 01:36 pm
I haven't taken any in a few days, I think I am fine now. This will be my last update for this topic. I didn't really have a hard time getting off this stuff despite a lot of other people suffering difficulties. My strategy of slowly lowering dosages worked for me.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 30, 2013, 12:41 am
That is good news to hear though!

Tapering off is the way to go, and i hope this story proves that point for anyone that got hooked on tramadol after needing it after an injury or such.

I hope this proves that tramadol can be a very effective medicine for acute pain and tolerance/addiction to it can be beaten if taken slowly. If you are in pain don't refuse it, just be aware it is something that will take some time to part from.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: sclerogal on May 30, 2013, 05:30 am
Good luck to you.  I must admit, I would think a physician would prescribe a 5mg Vicodin rather than tramodol. 
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Nyaruko on May 30, 2013, 06:32 am
Good luck buddy.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: motek on May 30, 2013, 07:35 am
IME Tramadol is an very deceptive drug, I took about 3-400mgs a day for several years,  and it wasn't until I TRIED to stop it 18months ago that I realised just HOW BAD this drug is!

While it IS a very good analgesic, it has strange effects the way it acts on one's seretonin transport system! And consequently is best not used for long (<2weeks) before 'discontinuation syndrome' (lol!) IS seriously taken into consideration.

 Actually the 'problem' REALLY is that 98% of drs have NO idea about this drug, and consequently dont 'see' or understand the issues a person habituated to tramal faces when they try to stop.

Yes tramal might have a MILD opiate effect BUT the truly 'powerful' aspect of this drug is it's SSNRI aspect, (which it shares with drugs like oxcycodone!) 
These SSRNI effects  are strong and the WD's are similar to other SSRI wd's BUT the problem is that most drs dont even 'consider' this, let alone 'take it into consideration!'
(a Dr I know now calls ALL SSR/NRI's  'scennari's" coz of the drama they create!)

  It seem the medicos have 'overlooked' this mechanism .... possibly becoz as soon as they see the word "opiate" they make all sorts of assumptions, but believe me, this drugs efficacy comes via it's SSNRI properties and not the 'opiate' side!

 How do I know this?  Well, I started getting Rx'd morphine, and thought "cool, I'll just stop taking tramal and as the morph's so much more potent I wont have any WD's from the tramal"
WRONG!!!    fuck me! I thought i had the 'flu' and that it had come on really fast!  But then when the projectile vomiting started and I felt like I'd had a dirty shot I knew something was up .... but, I had NO idea wtf was going on,
so, I had a shot of heroin...nada! wtf? 
I was puzzled! I took benzo's and smoked pot and felt terrible!!! 
WTF was going on i thought!??

Something made me jump online and look up 'tramadol wd's'  and there I read about 1000's of people who were going through the same thing!! .... I had some tramal asap!!

Everything 'bad' stopped!  I felt 'ok' !!!  FARKIN HELL!!   
 I have a very cool dr who I dont lie to. 
I told her ^^^ this and asked what he thought? ... and he certainly hadn't thought it was  the tramal!!

In fact it was SO 'unexpected' on his behalf that we ended up having this bizaare argument about him Rx'ing me some 50mg caps to use while cutting down, (which weren't very good for that purpose, and I went to using 'pieces' of 100mg SR tablets, which worked a treat)

It took me about 6 weeks to stop cutting down to 100mgs a day in a week, but any lower and I would go into this INCREDIBLY DARK place! 
The MOST horrible funk I've ever been in. I couldn't believe it was really MY 'mind' which was thinking this shit!
 Had I had a gun 'handy' I shudder to think the things I was 'considering' e.g death was NBD at all, for me, for you!!

TF I had some folks around to help me stay sane!  Truly scary stuff! 

Beware stopping longterm tramal use!  Opiates wont do shit to stop the WD's coz they're Not "opiate" wd's!

Looks like the OP is cool, I just had to write this for anyone else who it 'might' help.

cheers all m m m motek
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: jase00 on May 30, 2013, 07:49 am
The hole opiate thing is interesting...
I was taking oxies for fun for about 6 weeks (just like 20-40mg a night) then stopped... I *think* I had very minor withdrawls.. kinda felt like I had the flu for a couple of days... I was actually scared of the w/d which made me not stop.. which I know is stupid as it would just make it worse.... but anyways it  wasn't to bad but now I don't mess around for more than a couple of days in a row.. plus tolerance seems to build up soooooo quick and doesn't go down even if you stop for a while..

the hangover the next day when you take to much (160mg in my case ) is like unbearable. worse migraine ever..  its fine when you lie down then as soon as you sit up it hits you...

anyways glad you managed to safely stop :)
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on May 31, 2013, 01:02 am
Good luck to you.  I must admit, I would think a physician would prescribe a 5mg Vicodin rather than tramodol.

That depends on what part of the world you are in really.

In europe they are very reluctant to prescibe something like vicodain, but will prescribe tramadol if nsiad's just don't cut it, or of there are serious GI concerns with taking those. Things like tramadol are usually prescribed only for a short period of time - perhaps a week after serious dental work, maybe two after surgery.  After such timeframes you can quickly taper off and be fine.

Personally i don't use them often at all, but i keep a strip of tramadol just in case something unfortunate like a twisted ankle or knee that cannot be adequately handled by diclofenac. Obviously it has recreational aspects as well, but that carries a significant risk of addiction.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Miah on May 31, 2013, 03:12 am
I've been through Vicodin W/D's and Tramadol W/D's and the latter was a total horror. You get all the physical effects from Opiates plus the crying and thinking the world I ending. I only got the Tramadol cause I told my Doc I was abusing my script of vics. In hindsight that was a really stupid move. Anywas he said ok here's some Tramadol and will help with the W/D's take as many as you need. Needless to say I finished that whole scri tin two weeks and they wouldn't refill it and oh boy was that a horrible month cause was detoxing from vicodin and trams. Stayed away from trams for a month but know back on it. I'm normally a depressed person so I think that's why I have such a draw to the trams.

All kidding aside I discovered something by accident. Stims take away the tram w/ds. When I'm abusing tram i'll take 400-600mgs a day. When I got my hands on some adderall I didn't even want the trams. I didn't get any of the w/d's which was totally weird. I'm thinking it was because adderall releases dopamine which help countreact the tram w/d. It worked for me until I ran out of adderall lol..idk it worked for but everybody is different.

 Bottom line I'm sure everyone in the health industry knows it addictive but it all comes down to liability. Tram in most States is not controlled so if someone dies from an OD or has a seizure(not fun stuff, luckily never had one) then there's no blame or lawsuits. This is how the 'greatest' country in the world operates there healthcare system.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: motek on May 31, 2013, 07:23 am
hi miah, yeah it's a bitch of a drug.  It's very good mid to strong level pain killer, but IMO the SSRI effects of tramal outweigh any/all the so called 'opioid' aspects of this drug, which IMO have been massively 'overstated!'

IMO tramal is a better 'mood stabilizer' than  most of the SSRI's currently used for these purposes, (e.g. Paxil,Effexor,Prozac etc)  In fact the chemical structure of Paxil is incredibly 'similar' to MDMA!!

Something I discovered recently while shooting a bit of very good crystal mdma was by doing so, my opiate tolerance was significantly 'reduced' !!! 

To say that I was 'very surprised' by this is an understatement!   Without being too specific, I take Rx'd opiates daily, and after having some of this molly over 2 days, the next day I found my 'usual' dose of morph to have become about twice as 'strong'!  I was REALLY surprised, so I repeated this experiment a few weeks later, and to my surprise the SAME thing occurred!

I have no idea as to the 'mechanism' of what actually 'happened' here, but I'm going to do some more 'research' on this as the difference was significant! 
I've never  experienced  Any drug too have such an effect on opiates specifically,  and I never noticed it after rolling from an oral or bumped dose, only from shooting 30-50mgs!  sooo wtf?!?

I just thought you all might find this 'interesting' as well,  I'd love to hear from anyone else with a similar experience

cheers amigos

m m m motek x
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: goochihuh on May 31, 2013, 07:48 am
Tapering dose will help. Tramdol more readily prescribed here in Australia then oxy. It was ok , nothing recreational imo. Good luck OP just taper , keep fluids up and you will be fine.
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Miah on May 31, 2013, 09:12 am
Quote
hi miah, yeah it's a bitch of a drug.  It's very good mid to strong level pain killer, but IMO the SSRI effects of tramal outweigh any/all the so called 'opioid' aspects of this drug, which IMO have been massively 'overstated!'

IMO tramal is a better 'mood stabilizer' than  most of the SSRI's currently used for these purposes, (e.g. Paxil,Effexor,Prozac etc)  In fact the chemical structure of Paxil is incredibly 'similar' to MDMA!!

Something I discovered recently while shooting a bit of very good crystal mdma was by doing so, my opiate tolerance was significantly 'reduced' !!!

To say that I was 'very surprised' by this is an understatement!   Without being too specific, I take Rx'd opiates daily, and after having some of this molly over 2 days, the next day I found my 'usual' dose of morph to have become about twice as 'strong'!  I was REALLY surprised, so I repeated this experiment a few weeks later, and to my surprise the SAME thing occurred!

I have no idea as to the 'mechanism' of what actually 'happened' here, but I'm going to do some more 'research' on this as the difference was significant!
I've never  experienced  Any drug too have such an effect on opiates specifically,  and I never noticed it after rolling from an oral or bumped dose, only from shooting 30-50mgs!  sooo wtf?!?

I just thought you all might find this 'interesting' as well,  I'd love to hear from anyone else with a similar experience

cheers amigos

m m m motek x

Tapering is very effective for getting off tramadol though. I agree it's the SSRI properties that were the most devasting. The w/d's are very similar to what people go through with Effexor withdrawls. I can deal with opiate w/d's the physical aspect but the mental w/d from tram and the just being down for a week and no sleep was bad. But live and learn I guess. I enjoy my drugs but I hate being addicted if that makes sense?
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: motek on May 31, 2013, 10:52 am
Tapering is the ONLY effective way to stop tramal without trauma!  I honestly couldn't believe How severe the tramal wd's could be until I had experienced them a few times!

Cold turkey of any use of tramal over a few weeks is most unpleasant.  As miah says, the pschological component is big and nasty, and goes on for a few weeks, but the physical wd's were savage, worse than heroin, like having a dirty shot with vomiting fevers feeling totally shit and in bed just wanting the shaking to stop!  fuckin nasty, I couldn't hack them and HAD to cut down over about 6 weeks ... man I was feeling shit during those first few weeks but!!
Title: Re: Tramadolo withdrawals update
Post by: Ben on June 01, 2013, 12:37 am
'Worse than heroin' is probably an experience reserved for those that were once addicted and someone managed to get rid of it - for me it offers no basis for comparison. As far as i understand withdrawal from heroin is always a very unpleasant experience, no matter how slow it is done. This might have to do with many users  have to scramble for cash to get a shot while withdrawal already sets on on many occasions, whereas benzo or tramadol dependent people at least have the luxury to have a week or month worth of drug sitting in nice strips in a drawer somewhere.

Tramadol is a substance that should be prescribed in amounts that are effective at first, but also in decreasing dosages such that patients can taper off without too much discomfort. Unfortunately not all physicians seem to be aware of this and cut medication in too short a time frame leaving patients to fill the gap with tramadol ordered online.