Silk Road forums

Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: sniper123 on October 11, 2012, 11:06 pm

Title: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: sniper123 on October 11, 2012, 11:06 pm
I'm reading all across the internet about studies that say using these drugs lead to the brain swelling which eventually causes a stroke. I'm not even going to link to any of these articles because i believe that it's complete bullshit. I was wondering if anyone else thinks that this is just propaganda. I mean i seen what they did with the man in flordia. With the scares of zombies, 2012, what's next?
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: quinone on October 13, 2012, 01:39 am
When you say 'studies' are you referring to peer-reviewed publications?  In that case please do provide us the citations.

Substituted phenethylamine's drastically alter neurosynaptic plasticity, however, so there is some credence to the claim that it increases blood flow to the brain, but without citations, uh, skip over that paragraph in the news article.
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: sniper123 on October 13, 2012, 02:20 am
When you say 'studies' are you referring to peer-reviewed publications?  In that case please do provide us the citations.

Substituted phenethylamine's drastically alter neurosynaptic plasticity, however, so there is some credence to the claim that it increases blood flow to the brain, but without citations, uh, skip over that paragraph in the news article.
Do you have a link to that? Are these effects long term?

I think you're misunderstanding my point. There is a lot of mis information on the internet. If you could direct me in the right way i would greatly appreciate it. I've read all over the internet about these studies, but they don't mention citations to any medical journals or anything really. It's like i'm just supposed to belive it.
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: quinone on October 13, 2012, 02:48 am
When you say 'studies' are you referring to peer-reviewed publications?  In that case please do provide us the citations.

Substituted phenethylamine's drastically alter neurosynaptic plasticity, however, so there is some credence to the claim that it increases blood flow to the brain, but without citations, uh, skip over that paragraph in the news article.
Do you have a link to that? Are these effects long term?

I think you're misunderstanding my point. There is a lot of mis information on the internet. If you could direct me in the right way i would greatly appreciate it. I've read all over the internet about these studies, but they don't mention citations to any medical journals or anything really. It's like i'm just supposed to belive it.

A link to what?  I'm asking you for citations please.

Pubmed might be a good place to start I guess.  You'll need to have at least a modest understanding of phenethylamine analogs, and if you don't then you'll have to go read a book on it ... unless you 'just want to believe it'
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: iammadmad on October 14, 2012, 07:32 am
I don't think it's complete bullshit.When they said that drugs make your brain swell. I think they meant that drugs like meth, MDMA, MDPV increases blood circulation and body temperature, so you drink a lot of water and that is what cause the swelling of the brain and lead to stroke.

This happen to me personally, as I was at a show once and I took too much meth and MDMA and it became too hot for me on the dance floor. I began to chug water, I believe I drink at least 6 bottles of water in 1 hr and this lasted 2 hrs. I was sweating like crazy at the same time. My cloth was so wet and I could squeeze it and sweat comes out. My vision becomes very blurry, and my head started to hurt for a little bit, at that time i immediately know what is going on so I fly down to the restroom and pee out at list 2 water bottle full of piss twice and then around 4 am after I got home I also pee 4 seperate times from 4-5.

The tricky thing was that the body high was so intense that I can't feel anything below my neck. To this day, I still believe that it was a miracle that I survived, and I think god for the articles that I've read and researched about.People who didn't know wouldn't go to the restroom and let out all the water because they can't feel the need to pee.

I've been clean from meth since then.
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: microRNA on October 14, 2012, 09:12 am
quinone, i actually would also appreciate some sources regarding the effect of PEAs on plasticity if you could provide a couple please

i am not questioning you - i am actually very curious and interested to see what you were referring to exactly. i hadnt heard that before

thank you!
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: quinone on October 15, 2012, 09:34 am
@iammadmad, you are absolutely correct and I recant my statement about brain swelling.  I was referring more to the drug itself actually causing the brain to swell, not the actions someone takes while under the influence of these drugs.  It can definitely be dangerous if you drink too much water and yes your brain will in fact swell when you're overhydrating.

quinone, i actually would also appreciate some sources regarding the effect of PEAs on plasticity if you could provide a couple please

i am not questioning you - i am actually very curious and interested to see what you were referring to exactly. i hadnt heard that before

thank you!

I don't have any publications, but if I get some time i'll look into it.

It's just that these drugs cause a rapid change voltage potential's across neuron's  which inherintly disrupt plasticity from it's normal baseline (because meth for eg. induces dopamine to flood out).  But that can be said of consuming any drug, including weed, it's just that meth, meph and mdpv induce the release of neurotransmitter's MUCH more aggressively which would alter local voltage potential's so rapidly that in all the brains safegaurds against such thing's, it can't restore plasticity while the active metabolite is bound to the receptor, there are just too many bound receptor-ligand complexes releasing neurotransmitter's for your brain to keep up.  This is not to say it's permanent, once the active metabolites have been cleared your brain will restore calm to itself, it's just a matter of how long this takes and that relates to the drug user's frequency of use and which drug was used.  There's of course always the genetic factor of just how your brain differs from another person.

Also, it's the interplay of the amount of unbound/bound GABA type and NMDA type receptor's that mediate neurosynaptic plasticity and when you consume a drug that form's altered neuron-ligand complexes with one of these types of neuron's (most drugs have at least SOME specificity in the type of receptor they bind to) there's an immediate change in the amount of available (unbound) neurons and NASCENT bound receptor-ligand complexes (that is, the neuron has bound to a foreign ligand ... the drug molecule, not to one of your brain's natural enzymes, intermediary glycosides, etc. etc.) as such a disruption in this interplay results and plasticity is altered.

The brain is a truly mysterious biochemical system and it's only as of very recently that we've begun to develop crude techniques (and we have a LONG way to go) for observing the DYNAMICS of processes occuring in the brain.  Showing static observations that some ligand bind's this receptor, or that this GABA type receptor alter's the local environment have value of course, but we really don't know anything about how the brain responds to biochemicals until we can observe these processes dynamically as they are occuring.

I have no citations for all the stuff I just said above so it's all just conjecture.  But i'm sure a trained biochemist would agree with most of the claims/conclusions i've made because i've explained simple processes .... didn't even get into talk about biochemical cascades, lipid rafts and stuff like that :D
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: Zulu on October 15, 2012, 09:29 pm
wtf this shit made me sit up in my seat thats for sure
Title: Re: Brain swelling from meth, mdpv, and meph.
Post by: sniper123 on October 15, 2012, 11:22 pm
wtf this shit made me sit up in my seat thats for sure
Do you normally lie down in your seat?