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Market => Product requests => Topic started by: grdr on November 25, 2012, 07:43 pm

Title: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on November 25, 2012, 07:43 pm
Hello any chance of some chemist making clean 99.8 pure product ? I heard you could make it from codeine.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on November 26, 2012, 04:46 pm
come on anyone?
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: eddiethegun on December 01, 2012, 07:23 pm
krokodil, dude?
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: nosaj_thing on December 01, 2012, 08:37 pm
krokodil, dude?

the difference between krokodil and desomorphine is the difference between bathtub gin and blue label johnnie walker. the impurities like gasoline and other heavy metals from the crude and limited methods of making krokodil are what causes its awful effects, not the desomorphine itself

i would like to try some (pure), or any rare opiates for that matter, but it seems unlikely
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 01:17 pm
Some more info:

Desomorphine (Dihydrodesoxymorphine, Permonid) is an opiate analogue invented in 1932 in the United States, that is a derivative of morphine, where the 6-hydroxy group has been removed and the 7,8 double bond has been saturated.[1] It has sedative and analgesic effects, and is around 8-10 times more potent than morphine.[2][3][4][5] It was used in Switzerland under the brand name Permonid, and was described as having a fast onset and a short duration of action, with relatively little nausea or respiratory depression compared to equivalent doses of morphine.

"These are my subjective feelings after taking lab grade >99% clean desomorphine HCl.

It hits very fast, there's no such thing like that "slow" onset of morphine when you feel how it brings up the high to both your body and your mind ("pins and needles" feeling is something I love about morphine so if someone took morphine and e.g. heroin, then he/she knows why I prefer morphine to heroin). But it doesn't cause something I call "hammer strike" after i.v.'ing heroin (nothing, nothing, nothing, bang!). It has a great rush and it' very euphoric. But it lacks another morphine's characteristic - it doesn't add that much positive sedation. It's kind of speedy. If somebody has ever taken oxymorphone i.v., this can be compared to some degree. Also, desomorphine high lasts quite short. While morphine or heroin could satisfy me then for 6 hours, desomorphine would wear off after 4-4.5 hrs. On a weight basis I can say it was 8-9 times as potent as morphine. IIRC I used to take 100-120mg of morphine sulfate pentahydrate back then and I took from 10 to 15mg of desomorphine HCl; 15mg felt similarly strong to 120mg of morphine but let's keep in mind morphine in ampules (and that's what I was mainly addicted to) is morphine sulfate pentahydrate (there is ~75,2mg of freebase in 100mg; with desomorphine there's about ~88,2mg of freebase). As for me desomorphine kind of lacks "soul". The same thing happens with semi-synthetics with MOR/KOR and MOR/DOR ratios higher than morphine's (a good example is N-phenylethylnormorphine; just like I wrote in "Krokodil Chemistry" thread in ADD)."

I'll keep posting interesting info about this rare opiod I gathered. if someone has something to add please feel free. My goal here is to get someones attention and make lab grade desomorphine HCL . To me its a strange attraction and yes I saw some of krokodil videos but please leave desomorphine out of this. It's just an opiod like any other (toxicity wise).
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 01:25 pm
well i don't know where to write anymore.... I'm gonna die a virgin... a DESOMORPHINE virgin... Im tired of going around and asking every chemist to make a bit i would pay generously. it can be done from codeine. I would also expect a pure product 99.8%. I could be a guinea pig i would inject into my muscles ass and so on just please can some profesional chemist atleast tell how it is done and how hard it would be ? I cant beleive no ones selling it here i read in opiophile that someone synthesised it very good high decribed as short but speedy. I don't remember about rush... Ahhh... wouldn't it be wonderful to experience some different opiate rush once in a while ?  This substance is only available in one country in europe by the name of permonid. So no desomorphine is not krokodil if you want to call this innocent substance cal it permonid like heroin. What a wonderful thing it would be to have those two permonid and heroin. one is shorter and speedy another is longer and relaxing. two different rushes by your choice... I just want to clean shit off desomorphine because its simple opiod just got undeserved stigma like 5 times worse heroin. And what did it do ? Those russians nuts mix up chemicals and inject solution of mostly desomorphine morphine codeine and hazardous chemicals. So it definetely if you inject some acid in your arm there's gonna be concequences. Come on i would pay generously just for 0.5 or 1 gram. This stuff is 10x more potent than morphine. Would be very nice to have this opiod in the club.poor poor desomorphine what did it do..

Well one thing i know that when they Ived it they noticed that effect were like four hours and adiction potential was very high.. hell bring it on I can have 2 girls heroine and desomorphine.

sorry  for offtopic just want to attract attention. is it just me or there are people like me who are interested in diferent opiods and how would they differ ? especially rare ones the ones doctors doesn't use for addiction potential (like desomorphine) (evil) :]]

If I was a chemist i would definetely try to be the first to bring brand new opiod to the market (clean of course). Well those who does not use can't imagine how it would feel for a user. it would be like christmas. Maybe some santa claus will bring it here who knows who knows. Im gonna update my desomorphine hcl post in product requests and add more information I managed to found. I believed and still believe that its a very perspective drug. Just imagine high is speedy - perfect for snorting, who the hell knows how the rush feels like ? Thats what bothers me. Can't seem to get it out of my head. And price... interesting what price would be of clean product. I believe we will soon be using clean 99.8% desomorphine shooting wherever we want and  those rusian crocodil users... well if someone decides to inject themselves with that what can I say. Sorry for blabbing I'm a bit doped on heroin and i want DESOMORPHINE. Please if someone knows some chemist please ask if he could make a gram or so i would pay generously and my dream would come true. Also this is a long shot but does anyone know where to get seconal sodium-secobarbital-red devils?
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 01:52 pm
Desomorphine (dihydrodesoxymorphine, Permonid) is an opioid invented in 1932 in the United States that is a derivative of morphine, where the 6-hydroxyl group has been removed and the 7,8 double bond has been reduced.[1] It has sedative and analgesic effects, and is around 8-10 times more potent than morphine.[2][3][4][5] It was used in Switzerland under the brand name Permonid, and was described as having a fast onset and a short duration of action, with relatively little nausea or respiratory depression compared to equivalent doses of morphine. The traditional synthesis of desomorphine starts from α-chlorocodide, which is itself obtained by reacting thionyl chloride with codeine. By catalytic reduction, α-chlorocodide gives dihydrodesoxycodeine, which yields desomorphine on demethylation.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 01:55 pm
"Maybe the demethylation of dihydrodesoxycodeine to desomorphine is less sensible than from codeine to morphine, maybe just a reflux in a strong acid will work.. dont know..

What is know for now (here) is:

1 - Codeine + thionyl chloride = α-chlorocodide

2 - α-chlorocodide + catalytic reduction = dihydrodesoxycodeine

3 - dihydrodesoxycodeine + demethylation = desomorphine.

Maybe this will be the next illegal opiate on the streets... in russia is allready began.. And codeine is allways sold OTC in small doses.. if the procedure gives a good yield than with the potency of 10xmorphine that ensures lots of doses.. Heroin is just 2x or 3x morphine.. 10x is more profitable..
And home users could sustain their habit if they could do this at home.
For example, i can get 1gr of codeine for 2.5€ if the yield was even just 50% then i would get 0.5gr of desomorphine, and because the normal dose is 3 to 6mg per IV then i would get 83 to 166 doses (equivalent to h bags) from just 2.5€ of codeine.. theres no heroin in the world that can compete with that prices.. not even pods can..
Even if just get the low dose of codeine pills (8mg to 16mgs) they would be worth it cause after converting those mgs per pill are enought for more than just 1 or even 2 doses..
If this is easy done then its a fucking revolution for some junkies.."
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 01:59 pm
"Purification would be easy. But finding journal references, now that's the impossible bit.

The journal references for this come in basically two parts:
Codeine to alpha-chlorocodide

And then
alpha-chlorocodide to dihydrodesoxymorphine-D

The reference for the synthesis of codeine to alpha-chlorocodide is: (Small and Cohen, J. A. C. S. 52, 2214, 1931)
But if you look it up, you'll find that the article was called "Desoxycodeine Studies. I The Desoxycodeines", the authors are Lyndon F. Small and Frank L. Cohen, it was published in vol. 53 (not 52) of the Journal of the American Chemical Society on page 2214, it was published in 1931.

However, that article does not describe the synthesis of codeine to alpha-chlorocodide, it does however state that they prepared their supplies of alpha-chlorocodide the same way that Freund did, except that they ran the reaction for 2 hours instead of 24. The reference Small gave was:
Freund, J. prakt. Chem., 101, 23 (1921)

Which means:
Author = Freund
Journal = Journal of Practical Chemistry
Volume = 101
Page = 23
Year Published = 1921

However, this journal is impossible to find. Small also mentioned that thionyl chloride could be used to produce alpha-chlorocodide from codeine, he said that it had worse yields, and it was written up in another impossible to find journal:
Wieland and Kappelmaier, Ann., 382, 337 (1911)

Which means:
Author = Wieland and Kappelmaier
Journal = Annuals of Chemistry?
Volume = 382
Page = 337
Year Published = 1911

However if you already have alpha-chlorocodide then a good reference to convert it into dihydrodesoxymorphine-D is a US Patent 1980972, by Lyndon F. Small, "Morphine Derivative and Processes for its Preparation" date 1934.

Here Small describes how alpha-chlorocodide is hydrogenated with palladium on barium sulfate, which converts it into dihydrodesoxycodeine-D. He then describes the process of converting dihydrodesoxycodeine-D into dihydrodesoxymorphine-D by demethylating it with 48% hydrobromic acid.

Now I can see how if the Russian codeine to alpha-chlorocodide synthesis with thionyl chloride works, then hydroiodic acid could be a workable subsitute for hydrobromic acid.

So then apart from the codeine, you'd need an industrial lithium-thionyl chloride cell battery for it's thionyl chloride, plus red phosphorus from match books and iodine to make the hydroiodic acid. It could work, but without the journal references for the codeine to alpha-chlorocodide syntheis, you'd be shooting in the dark. It might be a case of mixing the two together then heating them for 2 hours. You'd have to do an extraction after that of course.

I'm not actually sure what the Russian desomorphine cooks are actually producing. Codeine is reduced into dihydrocodeine, not alpha-chlorocodide. And hydrobromic acid or hydroiodic acid act as demethylation agents which convert codeine-type opioids into morphine-type opioids. But I've read that codeine can't be converted into morphine by this route, because it doesn't work or else the yields are impossibly low, which is why the Aus/ NZ home bakers used pyridine.

So what ever those Russian guys are making, HI acid alone will not produce desomorphine from codeine. So unless they are going the whole route, with the thionyl chloride batteries, they are just blindly mixing chemicals and hoping it will convert the codeine into something else.

Whatever it is though, all they have to do to clean it up after the reaction, is raise the pH of the solution with sodium carbonate (washing soda) upto pH 10-11. Then extract into toluene. Then separate and dry the toluene then gas with hydrogen chloride gas. Then filter out the crystals and dry them fully for a couple of days before use."
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 02:02 pm
"The Russian makers only get a low yield or an impure product BUT codeine phosphate capsules are about $1.50/50x25mg so the start material is cheap. The exact route varies from maker to maker but they all seem to do more or less this:

1-Codeine + SOCl2 ---> α-Chlorocodide + HCl + SO2

2-α-Chlorocodide + I2 ---> 7,8 diiodo α-Chlorocodide

3-7,8 diiodo α-Chlorocodide + HI ----> desomorphine

Basically steps 2 & 3 are done in 1 pot. The iodine adds across the 7,8 double-bond in the same way Br adds across a double bond. The chemist then adds P to make HI which is a reducing agent. It removes the Is. The HI also demethylates the 3-methoxy. Looking at a list of the stuff formed, 6 or 7 impurities are found in varying amounts. Yield of product is about 30% at best. Of course, the stuff is x10 morphine so about 4x heroin (the BNF directs doctors that diamorphine is x2.5 morphine in medical uses).
Now, the product has a bare phenol on it so it cannot be smoked. One can readily esterify this compound (acetyl ester, nicotinic ester and so on) so it's BP becomes sufficiently low.
I will do a full test including pictures if enough people ask me to. It's about £300 of stuff I will use and I have no interest in taking the product... or selling... or giving away."


Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 02:03 pm
"Now, I notice that the OFFICIAL synthesis from codeine goes something like this:


React SOCl2 with codeine, purify with 2M HCl then precipitate with Sodium Carbonate extract the amorphous precipitate rapidly into ether. Repeat, then wash with cold ethanol, with removes further inpurities. This give a-chlorocodide freebase.

Five grams of a-chlorocodide suspended in 100 ml of water was brought into solution by addition of 37% hydrochloric acid and hydrogenated in the presence of 1.05 g. of palladium-barium sulfate. The absorption amounted to 2.27 moles of hydrogen most of which was taken up in the first hour. Expect it to be finished in under 11 hours.

By precipitation with ammonia and extraction with ether, 1.5 g. of Dihydrodesoxycodeine-D hemihydrate was obtained.

A solution of 1.5 g. of dihydrodesoxycodeine-D in 4.5 ml of hydriodic acid, sp. gr. 1.7 was boiled vigorously for three minutes.

To the cooled solution, water (about 15 cc.) was added slowly with scratching until crystals no longer separated. The mixture was warmed nearly to boiling, whereby the crystals became pure white and more granular. The yield of dihydrodesoxymorphine-D hydriodide was 1.73 g.


I would just point out that the Russians don't use hydrogenation equipment. Its all done using VERY homemade apparatus. The above writeup uses HI to cleave the methyl ether BUT I would suggest that HBr in GAA @ 125C in a bomb would be higher yielding as the ether bridge will not be affected. Although the HI salt is formed, I would question it's usability. Freebasing into ether or THF & forming the sulfate salt would surely make the salt that passes the BBB efficiently?"

Source: http://forum.opiophile.org/showthread.php?23867-Desomorphine-10xmorphine-made-home-from-codeine
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 02:20 pm
Added some info not much but atleast something. I don't know much about chemistry but would like to know from someone who do how hard it would be to make clean product ?  Please share your opinions about synthesis of desomorphine. Would the demand for this drug be enough to try synthesising it ? Does it need any hard-to-acquire chemicals? Would you be willing to try it if it were sold on SilkRoad ? Do you think it might be in the same league with diacetylmorphine (Heroin) ? And has anyone had the chance to try it ? I only found one experience on the whole net and reading it made me even more interested (I copied it on this topic). And please - this is not krokodil. This opiod hadn't seen much succes because it was short acting and had huge addiction potential. nowadays it is only available in pill form in only one european country by the name of Permonid. So please I would like your input here what do you think about it? Would you buy it? Maybe you have the same strange attraction to rare chemicals (who gets you high obviously) like I do ?
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 02:24 pm
If you visit please say something that might attract attention of chemists I could be guinea pig if the product is pure and cleaned.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 04, 2012, 04:10 pm
yeah fuck it no one wants something unique only the same shit. if someone reading take pity on me and maybe make 1 gram illpay expenses please ?
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: ruthenium on December 04, 2012, 08:08 pm
500 btc for 50 grams tracked delivery included. This is the only amount I am doing it for
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 05, 2012, 06:03 am
Good morning. Sorry I reply only now and sorry for the spam well not spam i just wanted to add information. I was high out of my mind on amph heroin alcohol and benzos. But was serious. I am just a regular buyer who came to sr hoping to find rare stuff that he wouldn't be able to get in his country. I would buy 1 gram for 10 BTC but I can't aford to buy 50 all at once but I think you could sell them out very fast because there is alot of opiate users out here. Atleast in previous threads I've seen people who were looking for it too. Well I just hope it sees the day of light. And who wouldn't buy it for 10 BTC ? Every opiate user with half a brain would buy it because its about 8-10g of morphine.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 05, 2012, 06:04 am
Good morning. Sorry I reply only now and sorry for the spam well not spam i just wanted to add information. I was high out of my mind on amph heroin alcohol and benzos. But was serious. I am just a regular buyer who came to sr hoping to find rare stuff that he wouldn't be able to get in his country. I would buy 1 gram for 10 BTC but I can't aford to buy 50 all at once but I think you could sell them out very fast because there is alot of opiate users out here. Atleast in previous threads I've seen people who were looking for it too. Well I just hope it sees the day of light. And who wouldn't buy it for 10 BTC ? Every opiate user with half a brain would buy it because its about 8-10g of morphine however it's shorter acting.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 05, 2012, 03:12 pm
500 btc for 50 grams tracked delivery included. This is the only amount I am doing it for

Would it be worthwhile for you to sell it by grams for 10 btc ? Ive seen people who would like to try it and they're already using heroin. This is definetely not for newbs because its 8-10 times stronger. So its about 3.6 grams of pure heroin for 10 btc. Thats a very very good deal so you might synthesise it and put up a listings  and maybe bulk buyer will show up. The thing is no one has ever tried it here I've only seen 1 review on the whole net.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: TheGrandWizard on December 05, 2012, 04:50 pm
500 btc for 50 grams tracked delivery included. This is the only amount I am doing it for

Would it be worthwhile for you to sell it by grams for 10 btc ? Ive seen people who would like to try it and they're already using heroin. This is definetely not for newbs because its 8-10 times stronger. So its about 3.6 grams of pure heroin for 10 btc. Thats a very very good deal so you might synthesise it and put up a listings  and maybe bulk buyer will show up. The thing is no one has ever tried it here I've only seen 1 review on the whole net.

While the Grand Wizard appreciates free markets as much as the next guy, I am not entirely sure that selling grams of desomorphine would be a good idea.  This is a novel opiate: no SR buyer will have any kind of experience or any idea of what constitutes a reasonable dose.  Which means that people are going to be engaging in trial-and-error dosing, and that at least a few are going to wind up using the same dose they use for their street heroin and dying from it.

Desomorphine is 8x morphine: isn't that about the same potency as oxymorphone/Opana?  Imagine selling 1g bags of Opana to IV drug users who had no idea what it was but heard the rush is unbelievable.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: najanate2 on December 05, 2012, 05:18 pm
grdr u mentioned , 10 btc for 8-10 g's , im down.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 06, 2012, 01:45 am
grdr u mentioned , 10 btc for 8-10 g's , im down.

Just comparing if someone would synthesise this stuff.
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 08, 2012, 10:32 pm
so anyone willing to try synthesise clean stuff and see how it sells?
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: TheYowie on December 09, 2012, 11:04 pm
This compound sounds very promising, but it's a lot of work to create a demand because not only do you have to make the stuff but you also have to create and educate the market.

Someone pony up the 500BTC's so I can try it  ;)
Title: Re: Desomorphine HCL (dihydrodesoxymorphine)
Post by: grdr on December 10, 2012, 08:43 am
it is promising. if made pure it would be less harmful than heroin cut with god knows what. i would buy those 50g however I don't have that much BTC. Also i would need some kind of guarantee that it's clean and safe to use.