Silk Road forums

Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: chil on August 07, 2012, 01:00 pm

Title: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 07, 2012, 01:00 pm
Quote
First, a study by Resnick and Zeckhauser [31] shows that Internet users
in general disproportionately use positive feedback when rating online experiences. In fact, over 99% of the
feedback in the eBay corpus used in that study [31] was positive

Following a potentially bad experience with a seller, I started browsing a lot of the SR sellers feedback and couldn't help notice that even when the customer
is dissapointed with something, they still give the seller a 5/5 rating. For instance, even if the packaging sucked and the customer could have been in trouble because of it,  they still feel like giving 5 / 5.  So because of this inappropriate feedback, sellers get a high overall rating (>95) letting the customer think that to place an order with him is TOTALLY ok.

Processing was too long ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

No communication at all ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

Never received the package ? Oh well, he was very nice and made it up offering me a free lollipop, 5/ 5 !!!

Fuck that.

Feedback & ratings are here to help the customer choosing a worthwhile seller, not to satisfy his ego and popularity needs.

It does not matter if the seller is super friendly, or his product is the bomb. You need to rate objectively your customer experience and the rate must reflect your true opinions, regardless of any subjective considerations.

In a lot of profiles, you can see there is a lot of pressure  on the customer, he has to give a 5 / 5 or else, he'll be blacklisted (or something like that).

Because frankly, feedback is useless the way it is now. Many customers are afraid to give an honest rating.

There, I'm done.


       


Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: UKMJ on August 07, 2012, 01:10 pm
I agree, leaving BS feedback helps no one.

There also needs to be some kind of mechanism to deal with vendors that pressurise or threaten sellers to get them to leave a 5/5 feedback. The main concern here is that the vendor has address details of the buyer, threatening to release that is basicalky their nuclear option but that sort of threat should be met with an immediate ban by SR, regardless of whether they follow through with the threat or not.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: herbaman on August 07, 2012, 01:24 pm
Agreed, everyone just seems to be sucking balls when it comes to feedback rating.
Now leaving even a  4/5 seems like tiny kick, even if the product was not as good as expected.
It's become like just be glad you got it, VERY TRUE. But to enhance more feedback is just gonna make our choices way more rational.
Feedback mechanism's  have a lot of freedom in SR to adjust and update, too bad most ppl don't bother after medicating.

It would be of tremendous help too everyone if each could just slightly update about their inputs more.

Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: qrbr6 on August 07, 2012, 01:35 pm
The way I see it you should leave 5/5 if you received your package and it's the real thing. I know you don't want to leave a perfect score if it took too long or whatever but this is a difficult thing and risky thing to do. Keep in mind a 4/5 will detract from their score that they work hard for. Some of you expect too much from vendors who have a life outside of this and are very busy on here as it is. You're lucky you get to deal with them rather than actual dealers.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 07, 2012, 01:51 pm
The way I see it you should leave 5/5 if you received your package and it's the real thing.

Then it should be a 2/2 score.

this is a difficult thing and risky thing to do. Keep in mind a 4/5 will detract from their score that they work hard for. Some of you expect too much from vendors who have a life outside of this and are very busy on here as it is. You're lucky you get to deal with them rather than actual dealers.

I know all of this. Yet, sellers choose to be sellers. If their real life is too busy for them to be sellers in here, then they shouldn't be sellers or at least, let customers know that things may take longer than the usual SR standards. Or actually advertise that the packaging may suck so bad it could get you in jail. Or let people know they suck in communication, etc...

Also, I don't have to give a street dealer a rating, because it is a street dealer. Here, I have to give a feedback because we're on the Silk Road, so my feedback will be relative to the SR standards, not the street ones. It's not like "oh wow, I didn't have to go in shady streets and the online vendor didn't threaten me, I'm so luckyyy!!!!". No, the feedback system is relative to SR standards. We're all grateful for SR, but now, it's business and should be done intelligently. SR gives the luxury for both the dealer and customer to stay at home, and not having to do business on the streets. So the argument that I should feel lucky is bollocks, and can't be put forth in defense of shitty feedback. 
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Tunbear on August 07, 2012, 03:28 pm
I reckon it could easily be solved if the rating numbers had guidelines next to them...not rules, just suggestions to help people pick a number.

This way vendors are aware what goals they need to reach while users are aware that a lower number doesn't necessarily mean they're bad at it.

But on your point of SR standards I have to completely disagree; SR doesn't have a set of standards when it comes to sellers, the standards are set by the vendors themselves. You can see by their profile and how much work they put into it how high quality a vendor is, or how "dedicated" he is to it being his job. But you can also tell that some vendors are much more relaxed about it and just do it to ship a few goods.

When I first came here I picked that up pretty much straight away, it is just like eBay where you have a mixture of professionals and amateur sellers, and I adjusted my expectations accordingly..but then again, by coming to a drug market my basic expectations were for the product to arrive, and any information they supplied I would take that as a bonus.

The scores are based on the purchase in hand, so as long as it got to you securely (I do agree with a low score for any packaging that comprises the product but I reckon that's a given) I don't think you should be able to mark down for lack of communication and such.

Maybe over time because you've dealt with quality vendors your standards are set high, but you can't hold every vendor to the same standards, you need to accept the fact that at the end of the day, sure they're not back alley drug dealers, but they're drug dealers none-the-less.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: HardHustle on August 07, 2012, 09:29 pm
Quote
First, a study by Resnick and Zeckhauser [31] shows that Internet users
in general disproportionately use positive feedback when rating online experiences. In fact, over 99% of the
feedback in the eBay corpus used in that study [31] was positive

Following a potentially bad experience with a seller, I started browsing a lot of the SR sellers feedback and couldn't help notice that even when the customer
is dissapointed with something, they still give the seller a 5/5 rating. For instance, even if the packaging sucked and the customer could have been in trouble because of it,  they still feel like giving 5 / 5.  So because of this inappropriate feedback, sellers get a high overall rating (>95) letting the customer think that to place an order with him is TOTALLY ok.

Processing was too long ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

No communication at all ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

Never received the package ? Oh well, he was very nice and made it up offering me a free lollipop, 5/ 5 !!!

Fuck that.

Feedback & ratings are here to help the customer choosing a worthwhile seller, not to satisfy his ego and popularity needs.

It does not matter if the seller is super friendly, or his product is the bomb. You need to rate objectively your customer experience and the rate must reflect your true opinions, regardless of any subjective considerations.

In a lot of profiles, you can see there is a lot of pressure  on the customer, he has to give a 5 / 5 or else, he'll be blacklisted (or something like that).

Because frankly, feedback is useless the way it is now. Many customers are afraid to give an honest rating.

There, I'm done.


     

I agree for the most part, but I think this is mostly the staff's fault for making everything but a 5/5 considered "negative" feedback, which is why if the buyer had an overall positive experience, they give it a 5/5. There's nothing else to put but that if you had a positive experience. There's no slightly positive experience or eh experience. It's just positive or negative. If a seller gets mostly 4/5's on all his feedback he's gonna have like a 50% positive rating, which is bullshit if overall he does deliver the product and make the customer's happy.

I don't think it's up to you to decide who did and who didn't have a good transaction. That is up to them, and to each his own. It's up to you as a buyer (woah, buyer's have obligations?) to sift through that feedback and decide whether or not the seller is going to fit your personal needs. Idk why you would just look to the number to tell you whether or not a seller is reliable anyway.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Twelve_Pickles on August 07, 2012, 10:00 pm
i order two products, both identical. one from overseas one domestic.

the domestic order lays in processing for 7 days and takes 2 days delivery. good product.

the overseas order takes 3 hrs to move into 'in transit' and 3 days to arive. good product.

do both orders deserve 5/5 or should the domestic order recieve 4/5 because it took a week for the vendor to put it into the post?

i think yeah.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 07, 2012, 11:15 pm

I agree for the most part, but I think this is mostly the staff's fault for making everything but a 5/5 considered "negative" feedback, which is why if the buyer had an overall positive experience, they give it a 5/5.

How is it the staff fault ? I really think it's the sellers fault (by putting pressure) AND buyers fault (ass-licking, fear of being blacklisted, social pressure etc...). Anyway, whose fault it is does not matter that much. What matters here is the buyer's attitude.


There's nothing else to put but that if you had a positive experience. There's no slightly positive experience or eh experience. It's just positive or negative. If a seller gets mostly 4/5's on all his feedback he's gonna have like a 50% positive rating, which is bullshit if overall he does deliver the product and make the customer's happy.

I'm not sure with your numbers. If a seller mostly gets 4/5 ratings, then his score should be 80%, right ?

I don't think it's up to you to decide who did and who didn't have a good transaction. That is up to them, and to each his own. It's up to you as a buyer (woah, buyer's have obligations?) to sift through that feedback and decide whether or not the seller is going to fit your personal needs.

Yes, of course it's up to me, but my point is, if all feedback is flawed and does not reflect reality, how am i going to be able to decide which vendor I'm going with? If people only care about having the product in their mailboxes, is it going to tell me how much this vendor is going to be a pain in the ass to deal with ? Is it going to tell me that I might end up in jail because some moronic seller wasn't careful enough with the packaging ? The feedback is here to rate the overall customer experience, not the fact of just having received the product.

I think people are confused with what a feedback is and perhaps someone important here (such as DPR & allies) should clarify that. Because, once again, if the feedback is just here to tell me that the product is received, then I won't read anymore feedback.

See, there is competition on the road, and I'd rather choose a seller with great product, stealth packaging, great communication and fast processing & shipping over one who sells crap, does not answer messages, processes your order for a week, and send your package within a month. And frankly, I'd like other SR users to tell me that in their feedback.


Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: sassy on August 07, 2012, 11:18 pm
i am guilty of this. sometimes when i get my mail joy im so excited that i literally get wet! at this point i leave some super over rated feedback  ;D
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: northsouth on August 07, 2012, 11:25 pm
Especially the "5/5 Finalizing early" is a problem.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 07, 2012, 11:34 pm
Especially the "5/5 Finalizing early" is a problem.

This. People forgetting to update the feedback once they get their product.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: DiscountDank on August 07, 2012, 11:38 pm
This is some BS talk when people complain about shipping times.  If you get it within a week of ordering then there should be no complaints.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 07, 2012, 11:45 pm
this thread (http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=34364.0) is pretty much concerned with packaging and how one should choose such and such vendor depending on the quality of his packaging. Yet, much feedback ignores this.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Twelve_Pickles on August 08, 2012, 12:57 am
i order two products, both identical. one from overseas one domestic.

the domestic order lays in processing for 7 days and takes 2 days delivery. good product.

the overseas order takes 3 hrs to move into 'in transit' and 3 days to arive. good product.

do both orders deserve 5/5 or should the domestic order recieve 4/5 because it took a week for the vendor to put it into the post?

i think yeah.

i would like to know peoples musings on this?
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Shroomeister on August 08, 2012, 01:03 am
If you want the feedback rating to appear less skewed then make it a 10 scale instead of a 5 scale. 4/5 is a whole lot more hurtful to a vendor then 9/10.

Also buyers then need to understand that almost no vendor is going to carry a (100). Buyer should become weary of any vendor less then (85)?


Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Twelve_Pickles on August 08, 2012, 01:36 am
i agree with you shrooms, this has been said many times before & nothing has been done =[
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: keypro on August 08, 2012, 02:01 am
i order two products, both identical. one from overseas one domestic.

the domestic order lays in processing for 7 days and takes 2 days delivery. good product.

the overseas order takes 3 hrs to move into 'in transit' and 3 days to arive. good product.

do both orders deserve 5/5 or should the domestic order recieve 4/5 because it took a week for the vendor to put it into the post?

i think yeah.

i would like to know peoples musings on this?

You are totally right in that ratings should reflect all aspects of the service with that vendor. Which is why there is that lovely box to enter some text about ones experience after the rating score. I do not think the vendors should be punished because the rating system penalizes
their overall score so negatively from less than 5/5 though. We all know how it works and if you're like me I do not pass over a vendor because their rating is less than 100. But, a lot of buyers not familiar with the system would however. Whenever I am shopping I take a minutes and read through the actual reviews. I do this no matter what the sellers score is.

@thread TL;DR Giving less than 5/5 because an order was not perfect is really a pretty big slap in the face to a seller and their score. Is it really so hard to leave some constructive (negative) feedback in the box provided?

@OP  I agree however, that if the experience was just plain bad, no communication, crappy packaging, etc then of course we should rate less than 5. If the seller then all of a sudden can communicate and it is anything other than "I am terribly sorry you feel that way, is there anything I can do to make it up to you and maybe get that score back up" then you should report them as also being an a-hole here on the forums. ;p
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Tunbear on August 08, 2012, 05:08 am
You would seriously down vote someone for not shipping your product fast enough ? I'm sorry dude but that's bullshit.

Your standards are way too high and you're expecting more than what people are offering. Silk Road gives the vendor several days to put an order in transit, it actually has it built in because that is completely normal! You really need to get out of the mindset that you're dealing with a business. Just because some vendors wanna go that route doesn't mean you get to hold everyone else to that standard.

Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: flicky42 on August 08, 2012, 05:51 am
What we need to end is "5/5 FE"  Its bullshit and not actually feedback. Just finalize early (if you really have/want too) and don't fucking leave feedback until you actually have some feedback.

I hate when I'm trying to dig up information on a new vender and all I see is pages of FE FE FE FE FE it tells me absolutely nothing.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Tunbear on August 08, 2012, 06:20 am
You're forced to leave feedback though. I generally take a 5/5 FE as everything went fine, if it didn't they would have gone back and edited it.

Also I reckon a lot of people don't realize you can go back and change it (I didn't until quite recently)
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Hungry ghost on August 08, 2012, 07:45 am
You would seriously down vote someone for not shipping your product fast enough ? I'm sorry dude but that's bullshit.

Your standards are way too high and you're expecting more than what people are offering. Silk Road gives the vendor several days to put an order in transit, it actually has it built in because that is completely normal! You really need to get out of the mindset that you're dealing with a business. Just because some vendors wanna go that route doesn't mean you get to hold everyone else to that standard.

Damn right I would. Once you have placed an order with someone they have effectively tied your money up, you can't spend it elsewhere....I think vendors should all have something on their homepage to indicate the current processing time. Many already do this. Of course I don't mind waiting if I am aware of it. But some vendors process immediately and others take a week. I'd like to be able to choose.
      I do act as if they are a business. They are selling goods for money! What else would you call it? I don't expect everything to go perfectly every time but good customer service is easy to provide, just communicate and be professional. There's been a lot of threads recently by vendors about what they expect, and an attitude that we should be grateful they do what they do and quit whining. But the buyers are an important part of SR too.

           There is a flaw in the feedback system in that the penaltys for a refund are asymmetric. If the package doesn't turn up most vendors offer a 50% refund ( this is as fair as can be or at least equally unfair to both!) BUT usually the vendor will get 5/5 still whereas the buyer has a refund on his record.
      Actually thinking about it I haven't been through this process; is there an option for the refund not to show on a buyers record? Just that if not, I could be selective scammed, only get 50% and still have stats ruined.

I don't know, it's difficult to design a system like this without there being areas where it seems unfair. And there will always be ways to game any system. What we have isn't too bad.... It's the same on eBay; every one has like 97 ratings. Stat systems like this always seem to drift to top.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: lorenz on August 08, 2012, 09:13 am
Make it like the Ebay rating system:

The buyer has the option to leave general feedback as Positive, Neutral or Negative and leave comments (which could be more honest now) and THEN detailed feedback from 1 to 5 for product quality, shipping, packaging. The detailed feedbacks are AGGREGATED into an averge, so a seller will never know what rating a particular seller gave him/her. The aggregated feedback for packaging could be like 4.88 from all the transactions, for example.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: sweetbruzz on August 08, 2012, 09:30 am
i ma guilty of 5/5'ing cunts. not been scammed yet but i do leave out some things like "delivery too long". i just imagine the cunt still having my name and address, or being so desperate for more that saying "slow delivery" means i might not be able to buy anymore from the cunt

so instead it would be better to leave feedback the same way except have an ANONYMOUS star style rating system like ebay has divided into postage stealth, delivery time, quality of product, communication

then put the average rating next to the username instead of the fkn feedback... and let cunts update it when they like
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 08, 2012, 11:22 am
so instead it would be better to leave feedback the same way except have an ANONYMOUS star style rating system like ebay has divided into postage stealth, delivery time, quality of product, communication

IDK if the seller can see which customer said what. If it's the case, then yes, we need more anonimity.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: jameslink2 on August 08, 2012, 12:09 pm
so instead it would be better to leave feedback the same way except have an ANONYMOUS star style rating system like ebay has divided into postage stealth, delivery time, quality of product, communication

IDK if the seller can see which customer said what. If it's the case, then yes, we need more anonimity.

From the vendors side when looking at feedback left by our customers we can see what you bought, your account ID, the rating you left, the comment you left, and when you left it.

There are 5 points to work with 5/5 how about finding a way to break them up and discussing what each should get.

For example
Packaging == 1 point
Shipping speed == 1 point
Communications == 1 point
Product was as described == 1 point
Product overall quality == 1 point

Total of 5/5 points.

The way a person rates stuff is all up to them. From what I can tell, everyone seems to arrange the points in there own unique ways.

How would you arrange the points?
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 08, 2012, 12:46 pm

For example
Packaging == 1 point
Shipping speed == 1 point
Communications == 1 point
Product was as described == 1 point
Product overall quality == 1 point


How would you arrange the points?

Just like that, just like I always did, and just like I thought everybody was supposed to do it this way.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: d29sps3mj9sl on August 08, 2012, 06:30 pm
*I completely agree with the op*.  When you make a simulation of, for example, a stirling engine, and have a computer adjust the design of the engine to optimise it, the computer needs to know how well it is doing.  The parameters you care about need to be sumarized by a so called "objective function" into a single number, the quality score.  Clearly if the score is "100" for any engine that so much as goes at all, the system will not be able to do very well for you. 

The higher quality sellers really ought to be distinguished as such in *some* way.  What we need is more like *rankings*, not ratings.    The higher ranked sellers can sell manuals of their operating proceedures etc. to others later if they want to, so the whole community learns over time.  This would be a much more exciting and forward looking approach.

At the same time sellers may rightly object to being rated poorly for things outside their control.

I think a) Multi-factor ratings.  i.e. each seller is rated on several factors, things within their control and things in large part without, such as shipping times, which buyers nonetheless need to know, may help with this.

b)Secondly, it should be very clear, on the page where you submit your feedback, what exactly a rating means.  5/5 could mean not " no major problems" but "nothing could have been better as far as I can tell, nothing."  for example.

Would go a long way to resolve these problems.  Also, we need to be able to judge the buyers in turn somehow.  As I mentioned in another thread "reputaion system appears to be deeply flawed" (sic) there are other problems with the feedback system too, and it is absolutely the core of this site. 

The anonymity is needed to prevent the site from being shut down, mainly.  We are all perfectly capably of doing things on the internet anonymously anyway just by using tor.    The key to SR is that the site is within Tor too, so it can't be taken down.  If you think about it I think you'll agree that the main thing that SR does that other sites on the open internet cannot do, is stay up, allowing the data and so on on the forums and rating system, and elsewhere, to be built to a useful level over time.

And it is important to note that unfortunately there is an incentive problem here, too.  Like on ebay, those who run the site want everyone who logs on to see lots of 95% and 100% rated sellers, and nothing else.  Sellers might at first object to what looks like an attempt to pit them against each other for the benefit of sellers, too.  Which I would object to too.  But as I said, an environment with some ranking would help encourage innovation and progress, as well as strengthen the system.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: d29sps3mj9sl on August 08, 2012, 06:42 pm
Reading more of the thread now, yeah retaliation threat from sellers is also a real issue.  It is on ebay, and it's worse here as they have dirt on you, essentially.  That is another reason that things need to be done carefully and humanely for everyone.  Indeed, I have read that the same problem existed for pirates in centuries past; they had to govern themselves very carefully, by consensus, in order to ensure that no one went off in a huff and ratted on anyone else.

In that context, it only took one person to rat everyone else out and get them hanged.  We are a lot more durable than that, fortunately.  But concensus governance - i.e. making decisions in a way such that no one objects too strongly to how things are done - is a good idea anyway, indeed I would argue that it is the only way for a group to govern itsself. 

Because if anyone objects too strongly, you are no longer one group, you are two groups.  One dominating the other, like the majority pushing the minority around in congress.  Besides, it's more exciting, innovative, and promising to take the further view...  we need a situation in which sellers understand that not being rated 100% every time no matter how you did relatively, is not a  slap in the face, it is part of how the silk road needs to work to be successful in the long term, which is better for everyone.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: FollowIcculus on August 08, 2012, 07:02 pm
Yeah I agree with all of you guys.  More than once I have read a listing that said Raw/Pure/Uncut/Whatever and when I get it that is not the case.  Now if the seller had advertised it as "some pretty good shit" instead of "100% pure raw" then I would be inclined to give a 5/5 rating provided everything else went ok.  BUT if it is not as advertised, ie: some pretty good shit instead of pure best you've ever had, then I feel I should give a 4/5 so people know that its only pretty good and not as advertised. However I don't wanna be blacklisted or anything as SR is really my main way of scoring drugs. Too many sellers damn near bully you into giving a 5/5 even if you don't feel completely satisfied which is BS.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: flicky42 on August 08, 2012, 07:20 pm
You're forced to leave feedback though. I generally take a 5/5 FE as everything went fine, if it didn't they would have gone back and edited it.

Also I reckon a lot of people don't realize you can go back and change it (I didn't until quite recently)

See this the problem no body realizes that you are NOT forced to leave feedback. Just finalize and then don't put anything. When you get your product click the "orders" tab and it will still be waiting for you to leave feedback. I did this when I was starting out and I don't understand why no one else does.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 08, 2012, 11:23 pm
  we need a situation in which sellers understand that not being rated 100% every time no matter how you did relatively, is not a  slap in the face, it is part of how the silk road needs to work to be successful in the long term, which is better for everyone.

Absolutely.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: raven92 on August 09, 2012, 12:26 am
You're forced to leave feedback though. I generally take a 5/5 FE as everything went fine, if it didn't they would have gone back and edited it.

Also I reckon a lot of people don't realize you can go back and change it (I didn't until quite recently)

See this the problem no body realizes that you are NOT forced to leave feedback. Just finalize and then don't put anything. When you get your product click the "orders" tab and it will still be waiting for you to leave feedback. I did this when I was starting out and I don't understand why no one else does.

Until there is a button that says "Leave feedback later" it won't happen, most people realize that sites don't function correctly if they just change addresses in the middle of a process, so they just assume they have to leave feedback. It'd take the SR staff about 2 minutes to implement this, and it sure would be nice.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: drdroopy on August 09, 2012, 12:42 am
If i ever have to FE i always go back and change to the proper rating and leave a proper review once product is received and tested, there is no way in hell im going to leave a 5/5 FE if item was never received or it was junk....wish everyone would do this, im sick of seeing 3 pages of 5/5 FE
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: flicky42 on August 09, 2012, 01:04 am
If i ever have to FE i always go back and change to the proper rating and leave a proper review once product is received and tested, there is no way in hell im going to leave a 5/5 FE if item was never received or it was junk....wish everyone would do this, im sick of seeing 3 pages of 5/5 FE

I'm glad, but just an FYI (I'm trying to figure out a way to inform everyone of this) you don't need to leave ANY feedback at all. Just finalize early and do not submit feedback. It will be waiting for you in your "orders" tab when you actually want to leave feedback. Next time you finalize just click "finalize" and then or do something else or shut off tor once the page loads.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: jurdermunkie on August 09, 2012, 04:22 am
I was writing a post about the current feedback system and found this instead. I think buyers/sellers feedback should be made for all to view in helping with their decisions either to buy or sell. Cmon we are not stupid here. You have to remember what it is most of us do here and users/sellers of this type of "commodities" are not always the most upstanding citizens. As with any business sellers have to figure in some kind of loss from time to time. I bet there are not many users out there who at some point been ripped off. Thats the nature of the game. If we could be able to view the feedback then we might try and do better job in the future.  Everybody can see sellers feedback but buyers have no idea as to what vendors say about them or a particular transaction may have not gone smoothly and seller blasts the buyer to other sellers. Given the chance to view each persons opinion on the matter I think is crucial. Because if buyer and/or seller are scamming we now have the chance to see if there is a pattern developing from either party. Some vendors require you give them 5/5 first. Thats just bullshit!! I know everybody is gonna say research on the forum. I agree with that but some people can't because RL shit or they don't wanna have to just go on word of mouth because of all the schills. Buyers only have refund rates and money spent. What if refund was given and wasn't buyers fault at all? He still takes the negative hit and who cares how much money you have spent! Some people don't spend thousands because they don't have it!! I am for both buyer/seller being able to have enough information without compromise of sensitive material.. I think some retooling is needed and would like to see a better system put in place.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Delta11 on August 09, 2012, 04:39 am
i order two products, both identical. one from overseas one domestic.

the domestic order lays in processing for 7 days and takes 2 days delivery. good product.

the overseas order takes 3 hrs to move into 'in transit' and 3 days to arive. good product.

do both orders deserve 5/5 or should the domestic order recieve 4/5 because it took a week for the vendor to put it into the post?

i think yeah.

i would like to know peoples musings on this?
7 days is a bit excessive but did you try to communicate with the vendor before waiting 7 days? Us vendors get 4 days before we get an automated message from SR saying we're late and you guys (the buyers) can cancel on us if you want so I don't see why a vendor would wait that long unless they have a specific reason or are just shitty vendors.

It still sucks because 4/5s hurt us vendors so it's kind of irritating getting a 4/5 but it happens.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: RxKing on August 09, 2012, 04:47 am
I totally disagree...

If you receive your package in a reasonable time frame. And it has what you ordered. Then you should leave a 5 of 5.

PERIOD.

That means your package should leave the vendors hands within 4 days of you placing the order. And shipping time should fall into the days the vendor says it will take on there vendor page before you ordered it.

If you receive it ....then it was packaged great.

****************************************************************************************


Now there are other factors of course but none of those should matter.

MY THOUGHTS are your package should always leave within 24 hours of you placing the order. NO LATER.

I think your package (from USA to USA) should never take longer then 10 days as a general rule. In my case 5 days is the max as I only ship USPS Priority or Express.

You should never have broken pills. You should never be able to smell anything.

So if your package falls into that then you should leave 5 0f 5


Nothing else matters.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 09, 2012, 10:17 am

If you receive it ....then it was packaged great.

You really believe that ?
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: FenderGuitarMan on August 09, 2012, 01:29 pm
as it stands right now, many vendors, including good ones, say if you give them less than a 5/5 they will blacklist you and post your name so you are blacklisted by all vendors. Is this true? Why would SR allow this? Should sellers who say that be reported?

The good news is most of the sellers I've dealt with have truly deserved the 5/5 rating. But even if they didn't I don't have the option of giving less than 5/5 if I want to do business here. Can someone speak officially for SR and tell me that this black list thing is against the rules or doesn't exist? My perception is that it does exist and is widely used.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: gummydude on August 09, 2012, 04:19 pm
Quote
First, a study by Resnick and Zeckhauser [31] shows that Internet users
in general disproportionately use positive feedback when rating online experiences. In fact, over 99% of the
feedback in the eBay corpus used in that study [31] was positive

Following a potentially bad experience with a seller, I started browsing a lot of the SR sellers feedback and couldn't help notice that even when the customer
is dissapointed with something, they still give the seller a 5/5 rating. For instance, even if the packaging sucked and the customer could have been in trouble because of it,  they still feel like giving 5 / 5.  So because of this inappropriate feedback, sellers get a high overall rating (>95) letting the customer think that to place an order with him is TOTALLY ok.

Processing was too long ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

No communication at all ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

Never received the package ? Oh well, he was very nice and made it up offering me a free lollipop, 5/ 5 !!!

Fuck that.

Feedback & ratings are here to help the customer choosing a worthwhile seller, not to satisfy his ego and popularity needs.

It does not matter if the seller is super friendly, or his product is the bomb. You need to rate objectively your customer experience and the rate must reflect your true opinions, regardless of any subjective considerations.

In a lot of profiles, you can see there is a lot of pressure  on the customer, he has to give a 5 / 5 or else, he'll be blacklisted (or something like that).

Because frankly, feedback is useless the way it is now. Many customers are afraid to give an honest rating.

There, I'm done.


     

I agree leaving BS feedback doesn't help anyone.  The problem is when I try to leave legitimate and truthful feedback as say a 4 out of 5 which really isn't all that bad considering the product was garbage.  I  will not reveal the sellers name but I definitely felt like I didn't get my money's worth.

Also another time I never got anything the vendor refused to refund the money despite my 8 btc being inside escrow.  I felt like that it wasn't fair at all and every time I leave honest feedback I get bitched out about it by the vendor.

I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks anymore if and you shouldn't either if you honestly speak your mind and tell if the product was good or bad the vendor should refund you if it isn't up to par. bottom line
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: gummydude on August 09, 2012, 04:23 pm
Quote
First, a study by Resnick and Zeckhauser [31] shows that Internet users
in general disproportionately use positive feedback when rating online experiences. In fact, over 99% of the
feedback in the eBay corpus used in that study [31] was positive

Following a potentially bad experience with a seller, I started browsing a lot of the SR sellers feedback and couldn't help notice that even when the customer
is dissapointed with something, they still give the seller a 5/5 rating. For instance, even if the packaging sucked and the customer could have been in trouble because of it,  they still feel like giving 5 / 5.  So because of this inappropriate feedback, sellers get a high overall rating (>95) letting the customer think that to place an order with him is TOTALLY ok.

Processing was too long ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

No communication at all ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

Never received the package ? Oh well, he was very nice and made it up offering me a free lollipop, 5/ 5 !!!

Fuck that.

Feedback & ratings are here to help the customer choosing a worthwhile seller, not to satisfy his ego and popularity needs.

It does not matter if the seller is super friendly, or his product is the bomb. You need to rate objectively your customer experience and the rate must reflect your true opinions, regardless of any subjective considerations.

In a lot of profiles, you can see there is a lot of pressure  on the customer, he has to give a 5 / 5 or else, he'll be blacklisted (or something like that).

Because frankly, feedback is useless the way it is now. Many customers are afraid to give an honest rating.

There, I'm done.


     

I agree leaving BS feedback doesn't help anyone.  The problem is when I try to leave legitimate and truthful feedback as say a 4 out of 5 which really isn't all that bad considering the product was garbage.  I  will not reveal the sellers name but I definitely felt like I didn't get my money's worth.

Also another time I never got anything the vendor refused to refund the money despite my 8 btc being inside escrow.  I felt like that it wasn't fair at all and every time I leave honest feedback I get bitched out about it by the vendor.

I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks anymore if and you shouldn't either if you honestly speak your mind and tell if the product was good or bad the vendor should refund you if it isn't up to par. bottom line

Exactly.  Why even have a feedback option if they feel like if you leave anything below a 5/5 is unsatisfactory?  And they blacklist you wtf?

Some say it will even hurt your rating as a buyer if you leave less than 5/5... but why even have a feedback rating if it's going to hurt the buyer's honest opinion?
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 09, 2012, 06:30 pm
Quote
First, a study by Resnick and Zeckhauser [31] shows that Internet users
in general disproportionately use positive feedback when rating online experiences. In fact, over 99% of the
feedback in the eBay corpus used in that study [31] was positive

Following a potentially bad experience with a seller, I started browsing a lot of the SR sellers feedback and couldn't help notice that even when the customer
is dissapointed with something, they still give the seller a 5/5 rating. For instance, even if the packaging sucked and the customer could have been in trouble because of it,  they still feel like giving 5 / 5.  So because of this inappropriate feedback, sellers get a high overall rating (>95) letting the customer think that to place an order with him is TOTALLY ok.

Processing was too long ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

No communication at all ? never mind, I'll give it a 5 / 5.

Never received the package ? Oh well, he was very nice and made it up offering me a free lollipop, 5/ 5 !!!

Fuck that.

Feedback & ratings are here to help the customer choosing a worthwhile seller, not to satisfy his ego and popularity needs.

It does not matter if the seller is super friendly, or his product is the bomb. You need to rate objectively your customer experience and the rate must reflect your true opinions, regardless of any subjective considerations.

In a lot of profiles, you can see there is a lot of pressure  on the customer, he has to give a 5 / 5 or else, he'll be blacklisted (or something like that).

Because frankly, feedback is useless the way it is now. Many customers are afraid to give an honest rating.

There, I'm done.


     

I agree leaving BS feedback doesn't help anyone.  The problem is when I try to leave legitimate and truthful feedback as say a 4 out of 5 which really isn't all that bad considering the product was garbage.  I  will not reveal the sellers name but I definitely felt like I didn't get my money's worth.

Also another time I never got anything the vendor refused to refund the money despite my 8 btc being inside escrow.  I felt like that it wasn't fair at all and every time I leave honest feedback I get bitched out about it by the vendor.

I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks anymore if and you shouldn't either if you honestly speak your mind and tell if the product was good or bad the vendor should refund you if it isn't up to par. bottom line

Exactly.  Why even have a feedback option if they feel like if you leave anything below a 5/5 is unsatisfactory?  And they blacklist you wtf?

Some say it will even hurt your rating as a buyer if you leave less than 5/5... but why even have a feedback rating if it's going to hurt the buyer's honest opinion?

replying to yourself ?
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: msft1 on August 14, 2012, 12:56 am
Back to the topic.. Let's play a game. Tell me how many of the 5/5 (even 3/5) ratings below (copy-pasted from a well-known SR vendor) you could agree on :)

rating   review   freshness   item
5 of 5    No communication or package - SR admins refunded me. Thanks anyway.    8 hours    item
1 of 5    not received, no communication    14 hours    item
3 of 5    The package has never arrived, and as I was on vacation it went to auto-finalize.:(    22 hours    item
2 of 5    Order has not arrived, but I trust it will, order it has been really long since I have received it though    1 day    item
1 of 5    never showed up, ended up getting a refund from SR. dunno what happened.    2 days    item
5 of 5    Leave feedback here    3 days    item
1 of 5    Never received. No communication. Full refund provided by SR staff. Quite a shame because Dimitri's products were top notch.    3 days    item
3 of 5    didnt arrived, when said it was sent twice(!) but SR gave me back the money, so it´s ok. perhaps i will try agaib    4 days    item
5 of 5    Never arrived even though it said it shipped. Had to resolve through SR. Got 100% refund. Disappointed.    4 days    item
4 of 5    Reviews of the other people make the changa sound amazing!! Still awaiting for the package to arrive, I can't wait.    4 days    item

I swear I didn't make any of this shit up...
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: darthvaderstar on August 14, 2012, 01:00 am
I hate it when i see a feedback that says "FE Will update when received" and they never come back.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: jameslink2 on August 14, 2012, 01:53 am
as it stands right now, many vendors, including good ones, say if you give them less than a 5/5 they will blacklist you and post your name so you are blacklisted by all vendors. Is this true? Why would SR allow this? Should sellers who say that be reported?

The good news is most of the sellers I've dealt with have truly deserved the 5/5 rating. But even if they didn't I don't have the option of giving less than 5/5 if I want to do business here. Can someone speak officially for SR and tell me that this black list thing is against the rules or doesn't exist? My perception is that it does exist and is widely used.

I state on my profile page

Quote
If you order from me and give me a rating under 5/5,
without contacting me first and giving me a chance to fix the issue.
I will refuse to deal with you again.

So far, 99% of the less than 5/5 feedbacks I have came from people who just left the feedback with out letting me know there was an issue.

I have seen people who replace the words "I will refuse to deal with you again." with "I will black list you" but to me it means the same. I would not expect them to be added to the list in the vendors forum and I would never do it for such an action. However, if some one was to ask me about a person who is on my list I would let them know that s/he did not even have the courtesy  to contact me and let me know there was an issue.

Personally I would like to see a better rating system, but it is what it is.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Shroomeister on August 14, 2012, 02:47 am
I do swap names with other vendors who I trust/ trust me. And we name black listed names and reasons. Hell we may even have our own forum out in the dark net wilderness to discuss such things - since some of us are established, but not enough to get into the SR vendor section yet.


Anyway - yeah. I personally have a few people that I will not deal with, and the few vendors I do occasionally chat with have theirs also.

As far as "can we do this?" sure. This is a free market. I can choose anyone I want (or don't want) to deal with for any reason I deem fit. SR would not step is because I refuse to sell you shrooms. LOL cmon man.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: psychonauts on August 14, 2012, 06:19 am
what the website should do is calculate % of returning customers. high % = good seller.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 14, 2012, 09:52 am
5 of 5    No communication or package - SR admins refunded me. Thanks anyway.    8 hours    item

5 of 5    Never arrived even though it said it shipped. Had to resolve through SR. Got 100% refund. Disappointed.    4 days    item

Jeeeez, I should have a made a thread easier to read for retards. 
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: psychonauts on August 14, 2012, 10:11 am
other than auto-listing the % of customers that are repeat customers, it would also help to have multiple ratings per feedback. one rating for product quality, one rating for packaging/shipping quality, one rating for customer service.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: NeuroRelativizer on August 14, 2012, 06:33 pm
5 of 5    No communication or package - SR admins refunded me. Thanks anyway.    8 hours    item

5 of 5    Never arrived even though it said it shipped. Had to resolve through SR. Got 100% refund. Disappointed.    4 days    item

Jeeeez, I should have a made a thread easier to read for retards.

No kidding, those are the worst. Those kinds of feedback are the reason selective scammers still abound. A high up vendor can try to scam 10% of their customers, get away with 5% of them, and the other 5% leave a 5/5 because SR staff gave them a refund! Yes, let's all reward the scammers because staff stepped in and gave a refund.


"They're drug dealers, not businesses." Bullocks. If everyone gave serious feedback, it would just separate the businesses from the online street dealers like a centrifuge, leaving businesses with good customer support and excellent overall service at 90+ while relegating online thugs who don't care about their customers to 50-80, and the worst ones down below that till they die off.
Don't care if your shit arrives in a reasonable time? Don't care if it smells? Don't care if your pills are crushed? Fine, you get to choose from vendors from 50-100, knowing that the even shittier ones are below that because of honest feedback.
If you do care? Stick to 90-100, happily knowing that if those vendors stopped communicating, or stopped packaging safely, or slowed down by days to weeks, they wouldn't stay within that upper range.

Right now, it seems almost like the rating system is more just an alive/dying/dead indicator, with all sub-90 vendors hurting way more than they should.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: FenderGuitarMan on August 15, 2012, 02:57 am
No one answered my question. Why does SR allow sellers to blackmail buyers with the blacklist threat? It seems to really hurt SR rating system's usefulness and makes the ratings less effective. I have seen several sellers with much more appropriate wording such as (paraphrased): "here on SR my rating is my reputation and very important to my business. All I ask is that if you are dissatisfied you tell us so we can try to make it right." No threats are necessary. We all know there are kiddy scammers on the site and those types probably deserve blacklisting. But not every buyer with a complaint or an issue is a kiddy scammer. I am happy to say most sellers I've dealt with deserved their 5/5. But if I want to be able to do business here it is my understanding I have no choice but to leave 5/5 whether deserved or not.

I would really like to hear from SR admins on why the threatening language is allowed.

I agree with the poster above about the 10 point system giving  more room for a meaningful rating. Lastly I totally get that you will never please all of the people all of the time. So I don't expect a seller to hold a 100 forever, but I think twice before buying from one with a 59 or even 75. I took a chance on such a vendor recently and I was pleasantly surprised. We stayed in escrow so I felt somewhat safe, plus it was a smallish transaction. I was rewarded for giving the seller a chance with a very high quality product at a very good price.

Anyway as long as SR allows the blacklist language the ratings aren't going to change. Not unless buyers form a similar consumer union.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Tunbear on August 15, 2012, 03:23 am
Well I'd say because it's up to the vendor who they sell to, they wanna exclude anyone for any reason then its up to them.

Tonight I got a 3/5 because the drug the person bought wasn't as strong as he expected and even complained that it should be as strong as a different drug...I've contacted him to try get him to change his mind ( post here http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=32499.msg409170#msg409170 ) but if he doesn't I'll sure as shit be banning him from buying me again - I try to be very fair to every customer but this dick is giving me less of a rating because the drug didn't fuck him up as much as he wanted..

Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: prof_T on August 15, 2012, 05:47 am
funny i came across this as i changed up my sig a little earlier in response to my SR rating. 

i don't care about feedback.  or i should say i don't care about trying to get you to change it.   i was doing almost as much business when i had an 80 as i am now.   the bulk has increased with time like anything else, but other than that... about the same.    right now i sit with a 92.  i was up to a 95 before a slow shipping week last week.    or if you ask some buyers a perpetual slow shipping week. 

i'm not really interested in what people consider the right amount of time to get an order shipped.  the SR policy is four days before its late.  that seems reasonable for both buyer and seller.  if you ask, i'll tell you an ETA.  but depending on what my current situation is, its a guess not a promise.   i have four days.  after that you can cancel.   i try to get them out as soon as i can, but just like the buyer has 17 days to finalize, the vendors have 4 to process. 

-  if i have their order here, it will be shipped.    if i do not, it will wait a day or two. 
-  if they get my product in, i expect them to finalize as soon as they can.   if the can't right then, i might have to wait a day or two. 
-  if there is a special circumstance where i need to ship out soon to meet a deadline, they can write me. 
-  \ if i  need them to finalize as soon as it is delivered, like say on a bulk order taffecting my finacnes.... i write them.   

but i am not some automated meth machine that spits out stealth ass packages and remaining anonymous not only to LE, but to my community.   that is a difficult balance for me.   but check this out.... if you use the silk road market board and click on "drugs" so it is the top level category, then click on "domestic only" you can see that i am in the top 20 items being sold domestically.  the next thing you will notice is that other than me, every single seller with an item ranked ahead of mine has a MINIMUM 99 rating. 

what does that tell you?   that buyers are smarter than they appear and they too can see through the bullshit of trumped up feedback and many can ascertain there is a lack of meaningful correlation between the rating system and vendor reliability.   in my case, the rating is fair because i can be slow, and people don't like slow.   of course i give provide quality and people like quality.  so i get rated as such and it turns out quality is more important than time to ship for most people.  enough to keep me atop the meth listings, but not enough to destroy the competition as time to ship is #1 for some buyres.

i don't blacklist people.  in fact,   i hardly even read them, but occasionally will just to go back and try and appease them for the sake of doing what is right and not to get feedback changed.

having said that, i would never consider selecting a vendor with a 92 rating!   are these people out of their fucking minds?  :)   

prof_T
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Shroomeister on August 15, 2012, 01:57 pm
No one answered my question. Why does SR allow sellers to blackmail buyers with the blacklist threat? It seems to really hurt SR rating system's usefulness and makes the ratings less effective. I have seen several sellers with much more appropriate wording such as (paraphrased): "here on SR my rating is my reputation and very important to my business. All I ask is that if you are dissatisfied you tell us so we can try to make it right." No threats are necessary. We all know there are kiddy scammers on the site and those types probably deserve blacklisting. But not every buyer with a complaint or an issue is a kiddy scammer. I am happy to say most sellers I've dealt with deserved their 5/5. But if I want to be able to do business here it is my understanding I have no choice but to leave 5/5 whether deserved or not.

I would really like to hear from SR admins on why the threatening language is allowed.

I agree with the poster above about the 10 point system giving  more room for a meaningful rating. Lastly I totally get that you will never please all of the people all of the time. So I don't expect a seller to hold a 100 forever, but I think twice before buying from one with a 59 or even 75. I took a chance on such a vendor recently and I was pleasantly surprised. We stayed in escrow so I felt somewhat safe, plus it was a smallish transaction. I was rewarded for giving the seller a chance with a very high quality product at a very good price.

Anyway as long as SR allows the blacklist language the ratings aren't going to change. Not unless buyers form a similar consumer union.

Because not you or SR gets to decide who the hell I decide to engage in a potentially illegal transaction with.

I have canceled orders because a buyer couldn't get their PGP right after a 3rd try. If you can't master sending me an encrypted address. Then dont encrypt it. But if you make me deal with you for 3 days because you can not figure out how to use my public key then you are now a security risk to me. my product and my methods.

I speak professionally with a couple vendors that operate in my primary category here on SR. We have exchanged names of people that have blatantly tried to rip one of us off or another. kinda like:

"Hey look out for this guy - I sold him a 1oz of mushrooms and he gave me a 1/5 and said the weight was over, but they werent strong. So I offered him a FULL refund OR more product and all he said was nahhhhhh"

Yeah - I'm thankful to hear that story from another vendor. I DO NOT want to deal with that guy.

My personal peav is buyers that auto-finalize. I bust MY ASS to turn around orders once buyer place them with me. No one ever waits more then 24 once an order is place (unless its a week end) and so why do I have to wait 17 days to get paid? I do not ask anyone to FE. Escrow is awesome no doubt, but FUCK. I just busted my ass to get your order out the door. You got it. You used it. Can you come fucking finalize please? Why do I have to wait 17 days to get paid, because you are lazy. If I took 17 days to get you your package, you better fucking believe I'd hear about it.
Auto - finalize with me = black list (personal black list)

OK - what else?

As Vendors if someone is a headache. that is to say the transaction goes through, but they give you the run around on some stupid shit. I'll remain polite and help them out anyway I can, but again I will think 2x if I want to deal with them next time. As opposed to the 20 other people whose transactions went flawlessly.

And finally. As vendors we have no "outlet". Ya'll buyers get to give us and the world feedback. We do not get to say anything. This makes blacklisting so much more needed. If the vendors were able to give feedback on the buyers then I think (personally anyway) my blacklist would be a lot smaller.



All in all I think we almost all agree.

- Change the feedback scale to a 10 scale
- Allow vendors to give feedback (even if it is only for 5/10 and below) More like a rebuttal
-Make sure the community knows not to expect too many (100) vendors anymore.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: redcube on August 15, 2012, 02:17 pm
I think the largest problem exists in the feedback system itself.  the 5/5 system where anything but a 5 counts as a negative is very limiting.

My suggestions would be to use the same 5/5 system, but the sellers score would be something like 4.98 for a really good seller.  Also, it  would not be very hard to allow users to also give a separate set of rankings to...

1.  processing/shipping time
2.  product qualitypr
3.  communication

How convenient would that be?  You can see the sellers overall score of 4.95 prominently displayed, then when you go the seller page, you can see a breakdown score of each of the 3 categories.  I would find that extremely useful.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 15, 2012, 02:30 pm
All in all I think we almost all agree.

- Change the feedback scale to a 10 scale
- Allow vendors to give feedback (even if it is only for 5/10 and below) More like a rebuttal
-Make sure the community knows not to expect too many (100) vendors anymore.

Mmh, what I gathered from this this thread was that people don't use feedback the same way. Some people rate their experience one way, some others another way...Some people give 5/5 if they get a refund, some people give 5/5 if they receive the product without caring about other factors to consider....Some people don't care about good com, some people don't care about packaging or processing times.....Some people give 1/5 because they have tolerance issues with the product....

It seems then that what we need now is official guidelines on how to properly rate an experience, that is giving one point for this or that, maybe two for this....

We can't complain or talk about the game if we are not playing the same one.

I don't think then that changing the feedback on /10 scale would fundamentally change anything. What we need is set rules on how to rate an experience, and to stick to those rules.

 
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: redcube on August 15, 2012, 06:23 pm
i am guilty of this. sometimes when i get my mail joy im so excited that i literally get wet! at this point i leave some super over rated feedback  ;D

Well....that's kinda hot!  Very unusual Pavlovian response to receiving drugs.  Thanks for the imagery!    ;D
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: msft1 on August 15, 2012, 07:40 pm
All in all I think we almost all agree.

- Change the feedback scale to a 10 scale
- Allow vendors to give feedback (even if it is only for 5/10 and below) More like a rebuttal
-Make sure the community knows not to expect too many (100) vendors anymore.

Mmh, what I gathered from this this thread was that people don't use feedback the same way. Some people rate their experience one way, some others another way...Some people give 5/5 if they get a refund, some people give 5/5 if they receive the product without caring about other factors to consider....Some people don't care about good com, some people don't care about packaging or processing times.....Some people give 1/5 because they have tolerance issues with the product....

It seems then that what we need now is official guidelines on how to properly rate an experience, that is giving one point for this or that, maybe two for this....

We can't complain or talk about the game if we are not playing the same one.

I don't think then that changing the feedback on /10 scale would fundamentally change anything. What we need is set rules on how to rate an experience, and to stick to those rules.

Wow, that's some very good points. +infinity to you.  I WISH this was done for SR. It's a shame SR admins probably won't be convinced to change anything about feedback system (or much else for that matter). There is no incentive. Hell, they make more money when there's more good feedback. Also, they may prefer simplicity. Also, every change introduces new security concerns. So, we're not likely to see any change to the way things are now.
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: chil on August 15, 2012, 11:42 pm
]Also, every change introduces new security concerns. So, we're not likely to see any change to the way things are now.

How is it that every change introduces new security concerns ? How is it that some official guidelines on feedback is a threat ?  ???
Title: Re: let's end the overrated feedback
Post by: Shroomeister on August 16, 2012, 12:25 am
All in all I think we almost all agree.

- Change the feedback scale to a 10 scale
- Allow vendors to give feedback (even if it is only for 5/10 and below) More like a rebuttal
-Make sure the community knows not to expect too many (100) vendors anymore.

Mmh, what I gathered from this this thread was that people don't use feedback the same way. Some people rate their experience one way, some others another way...Some people give 5/5 if they get a refund, some people give 5/5 if they receive the product without caring about other factors to consider....Some people don't care about good com, some people don't care about packaging or processing times.....Some people give 1/5 because they have tolerance issues with the product....

It seems then that what we need now is official guidelines on how to properly rate an experience, that is giving one point for this or that, maybe two for this....

We can't complain or talk about the game if we are not playing the same one.

I don't think then that changing the feedback on /10 scale would fundamentally change anything. What we need is set rules on how to rate an experience, and to stick to those rules.

Right on.

some folks rate every aspect of the exp and other hand out 5/5 as long as they didn't get ripped off (even if SR had to return the $)

If the current system shall remain in place for the fore seeable future then yes I agree - there should be a "guide" on the wiki as to how to rate what, or what should be rated.

Another good idea is change the vendor rating to the 5.00 scale as opposed to putting the feedback scale to 10. Either way really.

I just think changing the vendor rating to 5.00 would confuse "some" :\

Who do I got to talk to around here to get an editor accnt for the SR wiki?