Multisig, Escrow, FE, Direct Deals

I had about 3-4K worth of orders on HANSA when the site shut down that I'm never going to send out. Because I'm never going to see a penny of that money. It was all in escrow. All of those people lost their money.

A few weeks ago, I had about 3-4K worth of orders on Alphabay when the site shut down. But every single one of those packs has been delivered to the person who ordered it, because all of my listings were FE and I got paid.

Everyone on HANSA knew that I preferred FE and Direct Deals, but that hasn't stopped them from sending me angry private messages.

This situation is EXACTLY why I support FE and Direct Deals being an option on the markets alongside multisig/escrow, even though I get fucking crucified every time I bring it up.

I made a post about this the day before HANSA got seized and everyone shot me down, being very very rude, calling me names, saying I just supported the FE option so that I could scam people, etc. etc. You didn't know it was me, though, because I made the post with a throwaway.

Not only was my post removed, I was literally BANNED. Just for sharing this opinion.

Maybe now that HANSA has been taken down too, we can have a more civil conversation about it. I know that me and my customers weren't the only ones affected.

There IS a place for FE alongside multisig, for people who trust their vendor more than the markets, so that they don't lose everything in situations like this where the markets are taken down.


Comments


[9 Points] ItsAllJustPretend:

For every vendor like you, there's also another one who is in a little bit of a trouble and can't wait to ramp up sales via FE to exit scam.

If only everyone were honest eh?

Off the top of my head I can think of probably 10 big name vendors who have disappeared and/or exit scammed with the help of a lot of DD/FE in the last year alone- some of whom most of the sub would have had no problem FE'ing for (such as MrSaturn).


[3 Points] throwathrowanz:

TBH, i have pretty much always FE and never been stung. The one time a package didnt turn up i actually had escrow, it was back on SR2 i think and the vendor was Tesselated. No idea if he ever sent it, was only a few tabs of L so no reason why it should have been siezed. I only got a 50% refund too so the only time i ever lost money was with escrow. And i know for a fact that there are heaps of buyers that use escrow and either never return to finalize or take fucking ages and that is not acceptable. I fully support FE if the vendor is trustworthy, obviously they could always turn rogue but thats just life. In conclusion some buyers are just as bad as scammy vendors


[3 Points] WhizzedFizz:

But for customers to willingly FE they have to build up a long trusting relationship with a vendor like you stated. And because the activities this community are partaking in aren't exactly 'legal' most of the people involved in this business are assumed to be cunt bag scammers unless proven otherwise - just how it goes, i've been burnt too many times to assume anyone is automatically deserving of my trust.

However, your point is completely valid, you just have to take into consideration that building up trust with someone in a community takes a long time and even longer when you're trusting them with your hard earned cash and freedom and dealing with criminals (technically criminals, but i love you all <3) and even then some people are too paranoid to FE anyways.

Just my 2 cents but i'll never FE even if I trust the vendor.


[2 Points] murderhomelesspeople:

Oh so you were that guy. I can see your point to some extent, but the whole point of hansa was to be a multisig market so suggesting FE made little sense.

Personally I don't mind centralized escrow markets, but if multisig is implemented and used correctly this wouldn't have happened and people would've been able to get their money out.


[2 Points] Fugduhfacts:

I oractically onky do DDs a good chunk of the most reliable vendors aren't even on markets.


[1 Points] DNMTiger:

Only issue w FE is even if i got my order in late that night or early the morning of the hansa ordeal , if it was on market the vendor would not have been able to withdraw and get the money, idk what the right answer is but this should be an eye opener that we need to figure out a better system in place for situations like this but also protects against the POS scammers( got burnt on a FE order that was placed 5 days before the shit storm happened by a vendor w all 5*s that had been around for a long time)


[1 Points] BOOFSQUAD_RELOADED:

I 100% agree with you, but as we've seen multisig can be fucked with if it's not kept in check like what happened on Hansa. I honestly trust a lot of my vendors way more than I trust any market right now so I'm a huge supporter of DD'ing. But at the same time usually I like to have some sort of escrow and I do have faith that multisig is the future and people need to learn and understand it so they know their money is safe throughout the process. Unfortunately however I still think big centralized escrow markets will still be popular.

A big problem with a lot of vendors is that they put all their eggs in one basket. Many vendors have no backup plan and don't prepare for the worst case scenario. A vendor should always have everything that they put in backed up to the exact dollar in a safety fund. For instance, if you want to invest 30k on a vending operation then you should have another 30k saved incase it all goes to shit. I'm also a huge supporter of vendors putting escrow limits on their accounts. Whatever amount you invested on a reup let's say for example 15k plus let's say another 1k for paying your drops and other expenses, and let's say you are supposed to make 30k gross profit on that, you should only allow your net profit at most in escrow on any site which would be 14k. So that way if anything goes wrong you'll still make all your money back. Some vendors get stupid and let their escrows get huge and end up totally fucking themselves.


[1 Points] Dontworrybeready:

There are a couple of ways to get the coins out of the multisig address.

Do you have the timelocked tx file? (BTW don't open it without Tails) If you don't have it, can you contact the buyers?


[1 Points] skankhunt92:

I will never FE unless it's with a vendor I've done business with for a very long time, and even then I'm loathe to do it. Big fan of multisig!!


[1 Points] Coolbreazzz:

Guy told me one time his second order ever was exit scammed and a big hit too- fuck you very much uncutking especially after he even donated money in tip jar because previous transactions went so smooth (y'all flame all u want he believe in taking care of those who take care of him) but when u find a guy doesn't bother him to fe