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all 107 comments

[–]The_Grid_Is_Up 63 points64 points  (0 children)

Farewell Gwern, you shall be missed.

[–]IGetDankShit 34 points35 points  (0 children)

:'(

It's been an honor having you as a moderator and we'll certainly miss your contributions to this community. Keep us updated on future projects. I'd still like to help fund a book on the DNMs written by you if that's something you ever become interested in. Much love and respect to you gwern, you're one of a kind.

[–]Jay-__ 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Like I already said; I hope you'll find something worthwhile to do soon. You'll surely be missed around here. :/

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (0 children)

A sad day for the DNM community indeed, you will be dearly missed

[–]BoxAddict 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I feel like this post deserves a montage or a slideshow with music. So much reminiscing and joyful sadness.

[–]SecondWarning 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Take care, Gwern. Thanks for your help moderating this sub.

[–]boxofpopcorn 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Thank you Gwern, for all of the popcorn.

[–]pxck 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Thank you based gwern

[–]ShulginsCat 8 points9 points  (20 children)

my overview of proposed distributed market systems from a DNM perspective

What's this about? Can you give some more details what you are thinking here?

[–]ShulginsCat 3 points4 points  (18 children)

Could I trouble you to share the list of proposals you found? (with or w/o your commentary is fine)

[–]ShulginsCat 4 points5 points  (8 children)

After a quick run-through I think Axis-Mundi (MayDay) has the best chance of being a winner. Although not a true decentralized market due to the requirement that some people run Broker nodes, it is the only one that runs over Tor and was built from the ground up to meet the requirements of buying and selling drugs anonymously.

Here's a clearnet link for the curious:

https://six-pack.github.io/Axis-Mundi/

[–]Fatvod 0 points1 point  (7 children)

I disagree. I just see some slapped together protocols. I really like the way openbazaar talks about the theory behind what they are doing, they seem to know more about algorithm and transaction handling than most. https://gist.github.com/drwasho/405d51bd1b1a32e38145

[–]ShulginsCat 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Sure, get OB to work over Tor and we'll have something to talk about.

[–]Fatvod 0 points1 point  (5 children)

[–]ShulginsCat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

eating my hat

[–]Jay-__ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

OT, but are you the guy that runs the 'All Markets Vendor Directory'?

I'm almost sure I already asked this once..

[–]ShulginsCat 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I looked into this a bit. Two things:

  1. One of the developers for the Tor port (El Presidente) is now a developer for Axis Mundi.

  2. The pull request for Tor support was never merged and the last comment is: "Closing this as it will most likely no longer work with rUDP. For now."

[–]Fatvod 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hmm. Interesting. The developers have been a bit quiet recently. I wonder what their plans are.

[–]BinaryResult 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Have you seen Drop Zone?

[–]ShulginsCat 1 point2 points  (2 children)

... except in Russia, for some reason

[–]BinaryResult 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We need a decentralized drone network :)

[–]The__Hans 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I compile a list too. At the psychonautwiki. It certainly needs more references. I think I’ll need to add some projects now that I see you list. Feel free to contribute. If you can not edit the page pm this guy.

[–]select1on 7 points8 points  (8 children)

ohhh wow this is cool, I want to see what's in there for Dnstats. I just bought DarknetMarket.com so I might make it public on there as some kind of archive.

We will miss a real asset here. Hope you pop in now and then. Take care.

I don't have much but I donated a bit over 1btc for your efforts. I'd give more if I can.

Just read your write up, Appreciate the comments. Cheers mate.

[–]select1on 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Cool - thanks for everything.

[–]select1on 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Is it possible to get a copy of your scraping scripts? I might continue if it's just a matter of space and bandwidth.. Just a thought.

[–]boxofpopcorn 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I have longed for the source code to Gwern's crawling scripts. Please become a reality.

[–]natenorman 6 points7 points  (0 children)

So much has happened this year in this community it amazes me. I've seen so much change in a short time, its almost as if I'm coming towards the end of the party. I can't really say where it will go from this point as usual you made some very fine points about stability and change in the community which probably will end up being true.

As soon as I saw this post I knew it was a retirement post, so many mods have left recently I knew you would end up leaving too. I saw your posting get lighter and lighter, with slight hints of frustration in them. Honestly even though you're leaving this whole board owes you.

I'm going to keep it short, thanks Gwern; you made the DNM's safer for everyone.

[–]drimilr 7 points8 points  (0 children)

wow thanks for this! and everything else!! your market analysis is why i became curious, and eventually, albeit casually, stepped into the markets.

good luck! and hope to read more of your analysis down the line; darknet, or otherwise (i might have tried n-back because of your site too. and no, i dont think i got any better at it)

[–]ciphersexual 5 points6 points  (9 children)

THANKS. Will you continue to moderate what remains of /r/silkroad?

[–]IGetDankShit 5 points6 points  (7 children)

Honestly that sub could really use some more active moderation. Take the top post there right now for example, the OP of that post was banned from this subreddit almost 3 months ago, and almost every single reply in that post is one of his shill accounts trying to trick people into thinking it's legit. A few minutes ago it looks like someone almost fell for the scam, hopefully he'll see my message and do a little more research before losing his money. So yeah, the sub needs more active moderation. I think you should stop allowing new posts to be submitted or manually approve all posts yourself, or find someone willing to do that dirty work. Right now that subreddit is a scammer's paradise and nobody is doing anything about it.

[–]IGetDankShit 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's not a responsibility I want to take on right now, but I do feel it is important that you do something about it, which is why I wanted to bring it to your attention. I know disabling submissions is not ideal, but it's a much better alternative than the status quo. Hopefully you can find someone who has the time to keep that subreddit safe for the subscribers.

[–]ShulginsCat 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Why does that sub still exist?

[–]IGetDankShit 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Perhaps you could sticky a post to the top of the subreddit which tells people that the subreddit is not being actively moderated and to be careful and vigilant of scams, and to always check /r/DarkNetMarkets for more information. Something to give unsuspecting people a little bit of a heads up.

[–]ShulginsCat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see the value, but the name has too much scope. Maybe /r/DarknetArrests ?

[–]KimJongUntouchable 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Change the CSS to point them toward this sub.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

peace out gwern. never forgotten

[–]FreeTradeCocaine 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Goodbye Gwern, thank you for all the interesting posts and your contributions to this sub!

[–]culdesacked 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Your write up on your site is impressive, well done. Thanks for all your contributions on DNM.

[–]Munchie_King 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Very rarely do I save submissions on reddit. This is pure gold. Thank you for everything you've done and taught - I've actually learned a lot from you. With that being said, I hope you have success with whatever future endeavors you may have.

[–]dsfadsfavxzcv 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Gwern, you are an amazing man in many ways.

I feel shitty asking you for one last thing, but could you explain how one might archive /r/darknetmarkets and /r/agmarketplace and how to set up those again if they are ever deleted/banned? Maybe on voat or somewhere else, whatever you think is feasible.

[–]coffeencreme 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Gwern I've been here in different incarnations, lurked and posted, and your work has always been amazing.

Good luck in whatever you do next.

[–]2ndaxct 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I have been lurking for over 5 months now. You have always offered valuable insight about the DNM's to me, as someone who had no idea about anything.

This is the first time i reply to a post by you. It will be sad seeing you leave, but great that you realized you have to move on.

Good luck with your next venture, it will be as great as your contributions if not more.

[–]simplemindedslut 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thank you for all your efforts. It's rare to have a voice of reason in these murky waters. This is a sad day for our community.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thank you for all you have done! You will be missed dearly. Much love and respect!

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The darknet markets would not be where they are today without you, gwern. You are the master of a very complex subject and I'm thankful of all your time, effort and contribution to the community.

Good luck, and here's to a prosperous future.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

5-10 years from now, I hope that things are interesting enough to entice you to come back again. I too am getting bored with DNM's development, but have high hopes for the future.

[–]BabyBunt 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Thank you Gwern, for exhibiting a rarefied and luminescent passion that shown its inspirational light on so many others than just myself.

For anyone interested in listening to a text-to-speech version of the silk road forums, 37-half hour episodes are currently uploaded: https://youtu.be/IUdwmerw4yQ

[–]ciphersexual 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I love that you're still making these. Please don't stop until they're shown in The Met.

[–]IGetDankShit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is... interesting. I wish there was a way to search the audio for threads I want to listen to.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thanks for everything Gwern. Downloading the archive now, I can't wait to look through it. I will always keep it as a backup anyways. All the best.

[–]Litecoin_Messiah 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Take care gwern it was nice moderating in this sub reddit with you in the past.

[–]BinaryResult 3 points4 points  (0 children)

You're a legend /u/Gwern !!! Where do you think you will re-focus your attention now?

[–]gwerforpresiedent 2 points3 points  (2 children)

thanks Gwern. Good luck on your next projects.

Also, I'm interested in this material but am not sure if it is really accessible to me. Will I be able to understand the files and material if I've only got a BASIC understanding of webscraping/python?

[–]gwerforpresiedent 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks you. You have built a recognized and reputable name.

Gwern for President! 4 More Years!

[–]scoopydoopypoopy 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you for all your effort gwern! It must have required some serious personal willpower to keep up with it all, and it is immensely appreciated

[–]select1on 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I am seeding this Torrent until dnstats.net dies.. so for a while I hope.

[–]TotesMessenger 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:

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[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You will be missed and thanks for your efforts. I have spent hours on your site. Read some stuff twice....Enjoy your next efforts.

I think a good send off would be for everyone with leftover change in there wallet donate it to Gwern!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I will miss you and I hope you still browse and give good information when you can. I hope they don't take down this subreddit, either, tomorrow. Either way, thank you for everything you've done, I'll catch you on the flip side.

[–]Axaq 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fantastic work Gwern, this will help tremendously with my own ventures, good luck for the future pal.

[–]herodose1943 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Fuck that last line sent chills down my spine. It's sad to see you go Gwern but thank you for your amazing work.

[–]ciphersexual 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Did you google the last line too? I thought for sure it was "from something," but apparently it's just from Gwern.

[–]herodose1943 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No I didn't, though it's no surprise that it's from Gwern.

[–]SecondWarning 1 point2 points  (1 child)

What are your guys' thoughts on this?

https://www.reddit.com/r/DEAagents/

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

So are the archives a 50gb download or a terabyte?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

So a Terabyte? And I'm super new to this site and the DNM's but the praise here to you is something extraordinary and from reviewing some of the contents of these archives you seem like a VERY smart guy. Wish I knew 1/2 of what you do. Thanks for the contribution and paving the way to.....endless possibilities?

[–]VH-TJF 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No not a 'terabyte'. Because 'former' = 'the first one' = 50gb. He should have just answered '50gb' again for you... less keys to tap, less English for you to re-learn.

[–]sobulbous 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Have you been cast as a synth on Humans or something?

Seriously, this data is invaluable and your efforts always went above and beyond. Thank you.

[–]PathlessDemon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've only been subbed here to see just a handful of your helpful additions /u/Gwern, but thank you for everything you've done in this community.

I hope you're next project keeps you happy with a stellar fanbase as you've made here as a mod.

[–]r0k1t 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hey Gwern, i think I'm not only speaking for myself, when I say that it truly has been an amazing time, since I get to know you earlier this year. I cannot think of much people or things that have brought so much entertainment and interesting content to me.

While I'm also a bit sad to hear that you are stepping down as a mod and probably will spend less time on DNM research, I also hope you will still hang out in IRC and/or reddit and we get to witness more of your amazement!

I doubt that I will ever get to know a person as unique and clever as you are :)

On the other hand, I was asking myself for some time now, where you take the energy and motivation from to do all the stuff you do. Espescially with (from what I could see) not that much love coming back from the community. I'm following the whole DNM/SR Trial/etc. since about end '14 and a small oversaturation has set in on me too.

I hope you will find something as interesting as the DNM scene was and we get to know what its about.

If everybody would be honest, he/she would donate you a bit, for all your work and effort. I have payed much more for things that had much less value than what you do.

I wish You all the best!

Greetings

r0kit

[–]LedLevee 0 points1 point  (2 children)

You mention that the SR1 model is surprisingly durable and that there seems little interest in developing multi-sig and trustless markets. I assume you refer to P2P and OpenBazaar like projects?

Why do you think that is? In my head nobody wants to really develop those because you can't make money off of them right? A trustless market has no commissions, correct?

If this is not true, could you explain a valid business model with a trustless market that also generates income?

Thanks for all that you've done for the community. Losing a huge asset today. Stay safe!

[–]ShulginsCat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

you might be able to turn a buck.

It would be great if we could figure out a model where the developers make a direct profit, rather than donations. This will give them an incentive to patch holes, provide upgrades, etc. Bittorrent has been a spectacular success for enabling illegal activity, but at some point it also became profit-oriented (TPB and uTorrent posting ads, and eventually BT itself going corporate). Maybe the same idea is feasible for P2P markets?

[–]galaxyandspace 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for all the info you have provided. Your reasons for stepping down sound quite similar to mine.

Good luck on all future endeavors.

[–]troubledteendwight 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for all your hard work! Awesome stuff here.

[–]gramsadmin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank You for all your hard work

[–]MXEMan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A deep and hearty thank you, gwern, for your efforts on behalf of all of us.

I feel much the same as you. I fear the lack of adaptation in the markets to obvious threats from thieves and LE will ultimately result in their demise. My personal business model moving forward is to gather a small, elite customer base and possibly work as a direct supplier to a dnm vendor or two.

[–]DrinkMoreCodeMore 0 points1 point  (3 children)

How many government special agents have contacted you since the subpoena ?

[–]DrinkMoreCodeMore 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Dont you find that odd? You are def being monitored and your public/private reddit activity being logged at least by a few different government agencies.

[–]corwin06 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I give you back your memories.

This is what "information wants to be free" means. It means never having to forget anything ever again.

This is the history of the Internet.

[–]Farfetchedchild 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for all of your work. You've been a huge asset to not only this community, but to representing research and journalism (as it should be) as a whole.

[–]wootpedofundingijaid 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Wow you even covered pedofunding? You should check out the newest form of it called pedo-co-operative where instead of paying for it you use your computer to mine darkcoins which are paid out to uploaders.

Markets are evolving, it just takes longer for some than others.

[–]wootpedofundingijaid 0 points1 point  (1 child)

TBH i dont get it myself, i think you just mine for coins it goes into admins wallet and he decides how its distributed. Its kinda stupid idea, i liked the crowdfunding model better, less risky, more choice.

[–]sapiophile -1 points0 points  (0 children)

<3

[–]Vendor_BBMC -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Nobody bothered to document the early days of rock & roll, or hip hop. They just seemed like fads at the time.

You had the vision to know that all the chaos and flailing around in the darkness of the darknet would turn out to be important, important enough to document.

Elvis is dead (well, incarcerated), and even you are starting to think the best of the DNM fad might be over.

Its not. Its just a bit like 1962. It seems like all the markets are bad guys, the vendors are bad guys, and even LE are corrupt. Ross may have been the first good man, uncorrupted by the bitcoin, to have a vision for the future. Im sure he wont be the last, so dont let a bout of tor fatigue get you down.

The same anonymity which allows us to trade also allows us to rip each other off, so what's the point in working so hard when its all going nowhere?

It IS going somewhere. Every problem will be solved, so don't mourn the loss of a technological red-herring like fancy escrows.

Scammers are weak, and they are stupid. They dont believe their own rational mind that the best way of doing things always wins. Reputation on the darknet IS THE ONLY THING WORTH COVETING. Why throw it away for a few bitcoin, or because it doesnt seem to be moving forward? Because it will rival the GDP of major countries.

I appreciate you,Gwerningham. I can probably infer that youve been taking shit behind the scenes.

DNMs are going to be bigger, better and more important than even you thought.

Don't retire now, or you will miss the Beatles on Ed Sullivan.

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